The Biggest Problem in the Universe - Episode 6

Transcription courtesy of: Megan Pennock

(Theme riff)

Maddox: Welcome to The Biggest Problem in the Universe, I'm Maddox. With me is Dick Masterson.

Dick: Heyyy! What's up, buddy?

Maddox: Same old! Doin' the podcast. (cracks up)

Dick: How ya doin'?

Maddox: Pretty great.

Dick: Alright!

Maddox: Pretty great. (smiling) So uh, I feel, uh...I see kind of a mischievous grin on your face today. I feel like your problems are gonna cause trouble.

Dick: No, I -- yeah, they are! Uh... (Maddox laughs) ...but I have another surprise for you that I'll get to.

Maddox: Oh. Great, great. (sarcastic)

Dick: Yeah! No, it's a fun surprise!

Maddox: Alright...

Dick: It's a good surprise.

Maddox: Well, it usually isn't. But, uh, we'll see. (amused)

Dick: It's a surprise that will make everyone feel good!

Maddox: Oh yeah? (chuckling)

Dick: Yeah!

Maddox: Oh, this is uh...this is a harbinger. So, let's get to some comments first. Um, so after last week's episode -- which, by the way, on the board the number one problem from last week was Conspiracy Dipshits. (gloating)

Dick: Mmm.

Maddox: CLEANED house. Followed by Marriage...then Car Insurance! Car Insurance actually showed! (Dick inhales thoughtfully) You're in the positive territory.

Dick: Man, I really hate your condescending recap of the problems. (Maddox laughs) I lose EVERY week, and I always get skunked, and you always read me the third place matters.

Maddox: Yeah. Hey -

Dick: (interjects) Like, you read it so earnestly and honestly, like...congratulating a child, for even placing on the board, and it just PISSES me off every time.

Maddox: I'm so glad you picked up on that. (cracks up) 'Cause that's exactly what I'm doing. And then we have, dead last, Table Nazis. And speaking of, uh, somebody left a comment on the board that said, "Table Nazis: Hey Dick, quit being a fucking vagina. Tim." (laughs)

Dick: Okay. (quietly)

Maddox: Princess Masterson. (grinning)

Dick: I'm... (chuckles) 'Cause I wanna sit at a table.

Maddox: Oh, yeah, 'cause you wanna sit at a table! (taunting)

Dick: Yep.

Maddox: Why don't you just sit...who CARES where you sit?

Dick: Me, man!

Maddox: "Oh, I need a...I need a table!" (dopey, effeminate voice) "One table for Princess Masterson, please!" (adding a lisp)

Dick: Yeah! (Maddox laughs) I don't care!

Maddox: What... (through giggles)

Dick: I want the table, man!

Maddox: You know what, though?

Dick: As I already covered last week.

Maddox: Yeah, yeah.

Dick: And I wanna -- I just wanna point out, I think it's the...'cause I noticed something that you're doing every week?

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: You phrase your problems so they'll look good on the board...

Maddox: Mhm.

Dick: ...and they're -- when in actuality they're a little bit different.

Maddox: Ehh... (skeptical)

Dick: your Monkeys problem?

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: That wasn' wasn't really about monkeys. It was about space exploration, but you made it that way so it would look funny. (Maddox laughs) So I'm gonna be on you for doing that in the future.

Maddox: Yeah, but Monkeys is one of the lowest-ranking on our overall problem list.

Dick: Good!

Maddox: So it didn't WORK. I mean, if you think that's what's going on. But, anyway. So uh, let's get to some more comments here. I got (cracks up) another comment from Matthew James. I decided if they publicly -- if they post publicly on Facebook, uh, then I can read their full name. So, Matthew -

Dick: (interjects) NO, no, no! (chuckling apprehensively) I don't think you should do -- okay!

Maddox: Yeah! Well, it -

Dick: (interjects) Do whatever you want!

Maddox: It's on the website,'s posted. So Matthew James says, "I've got a stats for you." You know what that's, uh, that's in reference to?

Dick: Yeah! (Maddox laughs)

Maddox: (sound clip of Dick saying, "I got a stats for you.") (laughs more)

Dick: What is... (cracking up) Hilarious. (sarcastic)

Maddox: Yeah, I love it so much. (smiling) I love it. I'm so glad...I was gonna say something during the episode, but I didn't wanna steamroll the problem. Anyway, one other comment -- I got an email, actually, from somebody who's a professional meat cutter!

Dick: Cool!

Maddox: Yeah! And he says that USDA -

Dick: (interjects) Ugh, this is gonna be more proof for YOU?! (yelling) (Maddox laughs) You do this every week!! You bring in emails and comments that only support your problems! EFF YOU. Go ahead, more about why I'm wrong about meat by some crackpot who CLAIMS to be a meat cutter. (spiteful) (Maddox laughs more) Who CLAIMS to be -- did he attach a picture of himself cutting meat??

Maddox: Well, he actually -

Dick: (interjects) NO. Then you have no idea if he's a meat cutter or not. (Maddox keeps laughing) Go ahead.

Maddox: Oh, Dick! You know what? Why don't you *ever* bring in some evidence to support ANYTHING you've ever said? You don't! (cracking up) It's always bullshit. Except you do -- last week you did, and... (sound clip of Dick saying, "I got a stats for you.") (laughs hysterically)

Dick: Go -- what did the meat cutter say?? (annoyed)

Maddox: He says... (through giggles)

Dick: What did the meat master say?

Maddox: He says that "USDA grading is really just a measure of marbling in the steak. And marbling is great, but it doesn't entail a great steak. The grading system is very deceptive too." He says -- now, this is kind of in support of what you said, actually.

Dick: Yeah.

Maddox: He says, "A restaurant can put any price tag they want on a piece of beef." Well, that's in support of what *I* said. And then he said, "And you can rest assured that they have a massive markup. That said, a 20-dollar steak on the menu is pretty much a guarantee that it's not a very good piece of meat. If you pay more than 100 dollars, it's more likely that they're serving you a better quality steak. Still - "

Dick: (interjects) Yeah!

Maddox: "Still, you don't - "

Dick: (interjects) That proves what I'M saying!

Maddox: BUT, " don't get a guarantee." That's what he said.

Dick: Okay.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: I got an email too.

Maddox: you really?!

Dick: It's also -- yeah. It's also from a butcher.

Maddox: Okay. (cracks up)

Dick: It says, "Maddox is a fuckin' idiot." (long pause while Maddox dies laughing) Hey, I brought you a present. So my, problem last week was Car Insurance, right?

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: Because...because they screwed up the rims on my car.

Maddox: Right.

Dick: And I told you -- what did I tell you? That when you take ONE look at these rims, the first thing you will think is 'Persian...

Maddox: Persian racing rims.

Dick: rims.' Okay, I brought you a picture of the rims.

Maddox: Oh, let's see this!

Dick: Alright?

Maddox: Yeah!

Dick: Here you go.

Maddox: Alright. [takes a look at photo] Ohh, wow! Yeah! (breaks down laughing)

Dick: What do you think?

Maddox: Pretty cool, bro. (chuckling)

Dick: Yeah. (sarcastic) (Maddox laughs more) So, I would like to -- Exhibit A.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: I would like you to call...I would like to bring your attention to the, uh, chrome rivets? That surround the rim, that are *not* black?

Maddox: Uh-huh.

Dick: On the black rim? Okay? Chrome rivets. I would like you to also notice the embossed lettering...

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: ...on the rim, in ADDITION to the weird,, crown in the center of the hubcap. (slowly for emphasis)

Maddox: Uh, that's, that's a...I believe that's the symbol of the rim company. It's called Motegi Racing? That's pretty cool, bro. (teasing)

Dick: Yeah! (quietly)

Maddox: You got ace number-one rims. (smiling) Uh, you should post that on the website. And post your other rims for comparison too, because I forgot what your other rims look like. What, what -

Dick: (interjects) I have a picture of them destroyed.

Maddox: Great. (laughing) Great! Post that!

Dick: Alright. (under his breath)

Maddox: But uh, let's...uh, let's get to the problems, yeah?

Dick: Sure.

Maddox: Um, go ahead.

Dick: My first problem is a little topical.

Maddox: Alright.

Dick: The U.S. soccer team sucks.

Maddox: Yes! Correct. ('ding!' sound effect) It DOES suck. (chuckling)

Dick: Yeah, and I think it's about time they get good! Like, we gotta figure this out. America kicks ass at everything except soccer. (Maddox smirks) And it's like every four years, I feel like the whole world holds it against us. Like, it's EMBARRASSING.

Maddox: Yeah. You know, that's the one thing the world has on us. But you know what's kind of...good that we have on them, is that we don't care. So.

Dick: (stammers excitedly) I care -- I'm sick of pretending I don't care!! (Maddox chuckles) I care that we suck at soccer and always lose, and never even get to the quarter-finals except for that one time in like, 2002. So I was at, I went to...I went to a pub, 'cause the World Cup is awesome for drinking.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: You get to wake up at like 7 in the morning and start drinking.

Maddox: Right.

Dick: Uh, I went to this pub, and my friends were supposed to be saving a seat for me.

Maddox: Right.

Dick: So I get dressed in all my cool Team USA, like, soccer gear?

Maddox: Right.

Dick: Kit, as it would be called? I show up and of course it's sold out, so I have to stand outside in my soccer uniform looking like a jerk, watching the game from the street as we beat Ghana.

Maddox: Yeah! We beat Ghana! That's cool!

Dick: You know what? I don't even know where Ghana is. (Maddox laughs) I don't want to be PROUD that our biggest accomplishment this World Cup is BEATING GHANA.

Maddox: You know what though, you gotta imagine it from the perspective of a Ghan-...Ghanese? Is it Ghanese?

Dick: See?! You... (stammers) You don't even know!

Maddox: Ghan-... (cracks up) Ghanese?

Dick: That's not an enemy for the U.S. to HAVE, man!! (shouting) We got, like, the Soviet Union is our bad guys! ENGLAND is our bad guys, not Ghana! (Maddox laughs)

Maddox: England has always been our bad guys. (grinning) Since...since what, the 1800s. Um, no, but it's so much more soul-crushing.

Dick: Germany! That's a bad guy! Not *Ghana*!

Maddox: Don't you feel good stepping on,'s like, something that you CLEARLY overpower.

Dick: Yeah, but we barely beat them!!

Maddox: And by -

Dick: (interjects) This is -- that's like, our rival! Is GHANA! (yelling frustratedly)

Maddox: (cracking up) By the way, this is so much funnier if you could actually see Dick, because he's wearing an American flag do-rag. (laughs) It's just incredible that he's makin' this...this argument here. Uh, I'll post a picture on the website. But yeah, I feel great that we beat Ghana! I feel like I've accomplished something.

Dick: It should be... (Maddox chuckles) It shouldn't -- we shouldn't even have had to think about it. It should be taken for GRANTED that we would beat Ghana. Of course! We're America! (Maddox laughs more) Of COURSE we'll beat Ghana! Like, you remember when we had the basketball team, the Dream Team?

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: It was a JOKE. We stomped all over everyone.

Maddox: Right.

Dick: That's what sports should be about!

Maddox: Yeah, but that's our *industry.* I mean, I GUESS, sure, but who cares, really? At the end of the day, who cares? Who cares who...who wins the World Cup? (chuckling) Uh, Americans don't! Unless you studied abroad for a semester and then you can't shut the fuck up about it in a bar. Like, that's...that's the one thing. But other than that, like, who honestly cares about the World Cup? Other than the rest of the world. Like America -- isn't that...isn't that, like, the embodiment of American exceptionalism, to not even care about something that the entire WORLD cares about? (smiling)

Dick: Well, I don't know. I don't know -- I don't really get what you're saying. (Maddox cracks up)

Maddox: I'm saying that.....okay. Have you even gotten in an argu-- well, okay. I know you HAVE.

Dick: Yeah.

Maddox:'ve gotten into arguments with -

Dick: (interjects) I got into an argument trying to get into that bar in my soccer uniform to watch the World Cup, yes. I got in -

Maddox: (interjects) Why wouldn't...why wouldn't they let you in?

Dick: 'Cause they said they were 'sold out'!

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: Like, how do you s-...? What are you, sold out of BEER?

Maddox: Yeah. Idiots. You know, I -- okay, I got a story about that. But anyway, you've gotten into arguments with your...with ex-girlfriends?

Dick: Sure!

Maddox: In the past?

Dick: Yeah!

Maddox: Nothing pisses them off more, even more than being right, than when you don't even care. Right? It's SO dismissive. Because that REALLY puts a fire under their ass. They get *so* pissed off.

Dick: So what are you saying, that America wins the World Cup 'cause we don't care?

Maddox: Right!

Dick: That is BULLSHIT. I care!

Maddox: Well...then you're -

Dick: We care!!

Maddox: - then you lose! (grinning)

Dick: No, that's... (defiantly)

Maddox: Yeah!

Dick: That is denial, man.

Maddox: Yeah, the rest of the world is terrorism, and you're America after 9/11 and you lost. (laughs)

Dick: That's too meta for me. I...look, I care about it, I think other guys out there care about it, and I want -- I'm trying to call them to action here. Like, we REALLY need to get good.

Maddox: Eh... (skeptical)

Dick: At the World Cup!! (Maddox sighs) And there's -- and so I was reading about it, right?

Maddox: Yep. Mhm.

Dick: Uh, I was...going on the Internet and doing research, and reading opinion pieces. (wryly)

Maddox: Right.

Dick: 'Cause that's good research. (Maddox scoffs)

Maddox: Sure.

Dick: And nobody even knows WHY we suck at soccer! How 'bout that?!

Maddox: Well, probably because there isn't as much money, we're not looking for the most qualified coaches necessarily, we're not looking for the best *players* necessarily, and it's just not on people's radars. Like, if there's a kid growing up in Oklahoma, coming up through high school...

Dick: Uh-huh.

Maddox: ...and, you know, all he sees is 'baseball, basketball, football' on TV...

Dick: Yeah.

Maddox:'s not even in the back of his mind that "Hey, I should try out for soccer." Uh, or football, with the umlaut or whatever the hell the rest of the world calls it. But like, it's not even on their radar.

Dick: I think -- here's why I think that's bullshit.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: Because we're the best at cup stacking, and there's no money in cup stacking.

Maddox: Is that true? Are we the best at cup stacking?

Dick: I don't know, probably. (Maddox scoffs and laughs)

Maddox: So... (cracks up) America's not number one in a lot of things, though. You know what I would care about WAY more than winning the World Cup? Is getting our Internet speeds up to just...South Korean levels.

Dick: Okay. That, you're -- don't hijack my problem.

Maddox: Okay. (laughing)

Dick: Internet speeds is not...I don't...I care way more about the World Cup right now than I do Internet speeds.

Maddox: Really? (flatly)

Dick: Yeah.

Maddox: That's stupid.

Dick: So... (Maddox smirks) Everybody said all the problems you just mentioned. Right?

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: But I think they're wrong.

Maddox: M'kay.

Dick: The real reason why I think the U.S. sucks at soccer?

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: Stick with me on this.

Maddox: I'm with ya!

Dick: Is that when little kids play soccer, they...adults take the fun out of it. *Only* for soccer. Like, you play baseball as a kid?

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: They teach you to whack things with the ball, they teach you to -- they teach you to shit-talk the other team...

Maddox: Well... (pensively)

Dick: know? You're all in the dugout together, conspiring, nobody can see what you're's fun! Football for little kids is about bashing each other. (Maddox chuckles) But SOCCER is about not keepin' score and teamwork. (Maddox cracks up) They make it lame! You learn all the worst parts about sports, like...SPORTSMANSHIP (cynical tone) in soccer. And they don't teach that shit in any other kids' sport!

Maddox: Dick, I don't even know if you're fuckin' with me right now. Like, of COURSE that's...that is the sport, yeah. You have to have some modicum of *teamwork* to make soccer work.

Dick: Totally false! See? (Maddox laughs) This is the American attitude toward soccer, why we suck at it! No! Soccer is...uh, punching another guy in the nuts when the ref isn't looking?

Maddox: Yeah. (dryly)

Dick: Fake falling? Fake falling, going "Wluhughh!" (giddily) "Look at me fake fall!" Like, THAT is what soccer's about. That's why it's FUN.

Maddox: You know -

Dick: (interjects) And that's what kids gotta start...learning, if we're gonna be good at soccer.

Maddox: Yeah, but the fake falling is the biggest pussy, bullshit move in any fucking sport. (raising his voice) And that's why I don't like -- I can't watch that shit. It just, it makes my, blood curdle. Like when I see guys fake fall and like, cry and pretend they're so hurt. I've seen people -- like, watch UFC. A guy will get punched right in the face and then brush it off, and then shake that guy's hand.

Dick: Yeah.

Maddox: But in soccer they fake fall and they pretend like they broke their nails or whatever. (disdainful) They just sit there and cry!

Dick: (interjects) Look, it's lame, I agree with you, but that's what it takes to be competitive on the world stage.

Maddox: Maybe it's a game that, uh, we shouldn't be...we shouldn't be playing. Maybe America should abstain.

Dick: Okay. So... (Maddox smirks) You ever see those, like, the English team? Walkin' around? They look like...they look like a-holes, and every time I hear a clip or a quote or a story about them, they SEEM like a-holes. Like they're always doing dirty stuff!

Maddox: Yeah...

Dick: The superstars, right?

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: Then I see *our* guys; they're on TV, and they're like, "You got any predictions for the game?" And the guy, uh, the main guy, Landon...Landon -- is that his name? Landon Donovan? I dunno how many d's he has in it.

Maddox: I...I dunno.

Dick: He says, "Yeah, I think we're gonna play a great game." Like, what?!? (Maddox chuckles) No!! We're gonna...we're gonna KILL them!

Maddox: Dick, this is...this is endemic in all of sports. This stupid -- what are you asking the guy if he has 'predictions' for? (exasperated)

Dick: I wanna hear some balls from this guy! (yelling) You ask him that to set him up to be a jerk!

Maddox: Yeah... (skeptical)

Dick: That's why you say, "How are you gonna do?" and he's like, "How are we gonna do?? Ghana's a joke! I don't even know where it is! THAT'S how we're gonna do." (Maddox laughs) That's what you say! That's how you know your team's fired up.

Maddox: Yeah. You know what could solve this problem, is just put wrestlers onto the soccer team. (smiling)

Dick: Dude, you read my -- you read my mind! (excited) I wrote that down!

Maddox: Fuck yeah -- we just fist-bumped. (laughs) That is SO cool. Uh, yeah. Wrestlers on a soccer team!

Dick: Stone Cold Steve Austin needs to be the coach of the men's soccer team.

Maddox: Hell yeah. ('ding!' sound effect)

Dick: Alright, that's my...I think that's all I got for this problem.

Maddox: Ooh, you're really fired up about this America -

Dick: (interjects) Dude, 'cause I hate losing!! We always lose! (yelling excitedly) And I gotta sit here and listen to my foreign friends, like, joke! They don't even make full JOKES about how bad we suck at soccer. It's just like, "Oh, did you guys even get in the quarter-finals this year?"

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: And I'm like, "Oh my GOD, I'll show you a quarter-finals!" (gritting his teeth)

Maddox: Yeah. 'Ever heard of Ghana? We beat them. Asshole. How 'bout that?'

Dick: Ugh.

Maddox: Um...okay. Let's move on to my first problem. My first problem is people who can't spicy food.

Dick: Oh! (quietly)

Maddox: Right?? Aren't you tired of that shit? Aren't you tired of pandering and kowtowing and having to go, "Oh, no INDIAN food, because I'm with Princess...whoever! Who can't eat spicy food."

Dick: I'm sorry. Someone who can't eat spicy food...

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: -- I'm talking about the World Cup, man. (Maddox snorts)

Maddox: Yeah. (sardonic)

Dick: A global athletic competition...

Maddox: Right. Yeah. (dryly)

Dick: ...that's worth billions of dollars, probably?

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: And you're talkin' about people who can't eat spicy food? (incredulous)

Maddox: Yeah! Well, you know -

Dick: (interjects) Who gives a shit about people who can't eat spicy food?

Maddox: Oh, excuse -- all of India, okay? All of India eats...pretty much spicy food, most of China eats spicy food. Most of Asia! That's like, that's already almost half the population of the WORLD. So this is a HUGE problem. So if you go to India, let's say you get...let's say you stumble into the unfortunate predicament of marriage. And on your honeymoon you go to New Delhi with your wife, and she can't eat spicy food.

Dick: Is this a real...? (chuckling) (Maddox laughs) Is this...where would you take your wife on a honeymoon?

Maddox: New Del-- well...I dunno.

Dick: Does that rank? Is that on the list? (grinning)

Maddox: I mean, you know, maybe if she's adventurous! Which she ISN'T, if she's not eating spicy food. (smiling) And I would've -

Dick: (interjects) Yeah.

Maddox: Yeah. For some reason -- you know, play along. (cracks up) For some reason if you didn't know before you married her that she didn't eat spicy food and you went to New Delhi, your honeymoon would be ruined!

Dick: Oho...oh, no! (mocking) (Maddox laughs) Okay. So Maddox's problem is...that his fantasy wife, that his hypothetical wife is ruining his honeymoon. Is that your -- should we name your problem that? "Ruined Honeymoons"? (amused)

Maddox: No. (playfully annoyed) (both laugh)

Dick: No, who did this to you? You're obviously're OBVIOUSLY talking about someone specifically who doesn't eat spicy food! (grinning)

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: What happened?

Maddox: Any of my friends. So, it ranks up there with vegetarianism and veganism in terms of what a pain in the ass it is to go out to eat with these people. Because it takes Thai food out of the mix, takes Indian food out of the mix, takes Indonesian, takes Ethiopian -- well, Ethiopian food sucks. takes most of these foods IMMEDIATELY out of the mix! They can't have any.

Dick: Mmhm.

Maddox: And also, if you get a pizza - "Oh sorry, no jalapeños!" They can't even deal with pepperoni, are you kidding me?? I went to a grocery store and I saw EXTRA MILD salsa! What the fuck is extra mild? Is that just tomatoes?? What IS that?

Dick: Are these, are they they *refuse* to eat spicy foods?

Maddox: Yes! Oh, they'll cry and bitch about it!

Dick: Okay. (unsure)

Maddox: And here's something interesting; I actually...I have some uh, some stats here. (sound clip of Dick saying, "I got a stats for you.")

Dick: You love that soundboard. (amused) (Maddox bursts out laughing)

Maddox: I love it so much! (through giggles) Uh, this is from PopSci. So, Mexican parents give their children packets of sugar mixed with red chili powder, which they eat straight up in order to build their spice tolerance!

Dick: Yeah!

Maddox: Huh?? How 'bout this: we all need Mexican parents.

Dick: I agree with you!

Maddox: There we go! Great! Finally, we found some uh, some common ground. I wish MY parents were Mexican.

Dick: You are, uh, you're a shady character. (slyly) (Maddox snickers) I'm gonna start with that.

Maddox: 'Kay.

Dick: These friends that you have, who refuse to eat spicy food? Do you ever think about like, secretly slipping them a gradually-increasing amounts of spice in their food to wean them off of

Maddox: Oh, yeah! It's...I've tried. I have snuck -- okay. Any time I hear a friend of mine has an allergy -

Dick: (interjects) I knew it. Right? I knew it! (grinning) (Maddox laughs) I knew, I KNEW that you had done this. Somehow.

Maddox: Yes, uh...for example, my brother thinks he's allergic to avocados. (Dick laughs hysterically) (Maddox chuckles) So, so -

Dick: (interjects) The most inert fruit that there is. (amused)

Maddox: Yeah. Yeah! Avocados.

Dick: Like, it's a staple -- a superfood.

Maddox: Yeah!

Dick: He is allergic to avocados.

Maddox: Sure.

Dick: Question number one...

Maddox: Mhm.

Dick: ...does such an allergy exist?

Maddox: Uh, not that I know of.

Dick: Okay, perfect.

Maddox: I've never HEARD of anyone else, I've never MET anyone else -- OH, just the other day I talked to some chick who said her friend is allergic to chicken! I'm like, "What?! Is that even a thing?? How can you be allergic - "

Dick: (interjects) Yeah! Sean is!

Sean, you're allergic to chicken?!? (shouting)

Dick: Okay, lemme tell this story. (grinning) Lemme tell this story. Real quick, Sean, before you jump in. 'Cause everyone loves the Sean chime-ins. I'm...I was pickin' up Jack in the Box for Sean, and he was...we're giving the order, right? And I'm like, "Sean, what do you want?" And he goes, "Um...ohh..." And he thought about it for a really long time, then he's like, "(sighs) I'll have a spicy chicken sandwich." (in a low voice; suggestively) (Maddox laughs) I'm like, "Sean, uh...why are you thinking about it for so long?" (amused)

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: And he goes -- for some reason I remember this VIVIDLY -- he goes, "Well, whenever I eat chicken, my fingers and my toes start tingling, like all night. Like they're numb."

Maddox: Oh!

Dick: I was like, "Uhh...okay, are you -- do you wanna change your order then?" He goes, "No, no. I really like eating chicken, but I' feet.....are numb. They fall asleep." They do something, I don't know!

Maddox: What?! (quietly; astonished)

Dick: Explain it -- explain what happens to your feet and your hands. [to Sean]

Sean: It started happening in my uh, mid-20s. And uh, I just noticed that when I would eat chicken, my arms -- sometimes it goes into my legs, but yeah, I just get the pins-and-needles about 20 minutes after. And it lasts about an hour to two hours. It's never gone further than that. I eat as much chicken now as I ever did. Um, I just notice -

Dick: (interjects) And you have tingly arms and shit? (grinning)

Sean: Yeah!

Dick: After you eat it? (laughs)

Sean: Yeah, yeah!

Dick: Isn't that weird?! (through giggles)

Maddox: Huh.

Sean: It takes about 20 to 25 minutes. And I looked it up; somebody had said it was an enzyme, uh, or something. And I've eaten the most processed chicken in the world *and* the free-range, organic...whatever, blah blah blah, bullshit.

Maddox: Yeah.

Sean: It must be something naturally-occurring, it happens with every type of chicken I eat.

Maddox: Including the broth? Like, if you drink...if you have chicken soup.

Dick: Oh, good question!

Sean: Uh...I don't know. I can't -

Dick: (interjects) Let's try it!

Sean: I can't remember the last time I just had chicken broth. But I eat plenty of chicken and it doesn't stop me from, you know, doing anything. And it's never progressed! But it was weird because it didn't happen until...I would say my mid-20s.

Dick: Lemme say, I don't believe that woman who told you that.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: I believe Sean.

Maddox: Yeah!

Dick: But I don't believe that chick.

Maddox: Sure! Well, lemme tell you -- so Sean, uh, that's... (sound clip of man saying, "Well, that's unfortunate.") (laughs) That is unfortunate. However, this GIRL, she said her friend's -

Dick: (interjects) Look at you, sittin' giggling! You love your little soundboard so much. (about to laugh)

Maddox: Oh, I love it so much. Yeah. (amused)

Dick: He's like a child. (laughs hysterically)

Maddox: They're great. Um...this girl I talked to, she said her friend gets migraines if she eats chicken. (cynical tone) Doesn't that sound like a bullshit thing?

Dick: Yeah!

Maddox: 'Cause most -

Dick: (interjects) And I'll tell you why.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: Because every chick's medical problem induces her to be a pain in the ass. (Maddox laughs) It's like every single problem -- like, Sean's tingling thing is funny.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: But -

Maddox: (interjects) It's hilarious! (smiling)

Dick: Every chick allergy is like, "Oh, I have this weird allergy, like if I see kids having a good time I become a huge bitch." (Maddox laughs) (Dick groans) GREAT.

Maddox: I feel like I have that, actually. (both laugh) Uh, I once met a girl who said she's allergic to *Cajun* seasoning. I'm like, "What the fuck? What, how do you -- how can you possibly be allergic to CAJUN seasoning?? There's like...19 ingredients in there!" Oh! And back to my brother's story about the avocados, speaking of!

Dick: Yes, PLEASE.

Maddox: So, I remember the day he developed this allergy. We went to a restaurant and we got nachos. And he ate the nachos -- the nachos had like, jalapeños, and tomato, and chicken, and beans, and cheese...

Dick: (laughing over Maddox) This is like...this is a nice night out for the Maddox family. (grinning)

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: 'We're gonna go eat some nachos.' (Maddox chuckles) The brothers are there -

Maddox: Yeah. (smiling)

Dick: - and... (cracks up) I have a feeling something really bad and weird is about to happen. (through giggles)

Maddox: Oh, well, you know. He just...well, he got sick from the nachos! And he came home and he just said -

Dick: (interjects) Like food poisoning.

Maddox: Food poisoning!

Dick: Okay.

Maddox: Yeah! And he goes -

Dick: It happens.

Maddox: - "Well, I'm allergic to avocados." I'm like, "How do you...?!" (laughs) "How do you know it's avocados, dickhead? You ate -- there was like, 10 ingredients on those nachos! You just arbitrarily picked avocados!" So from that day on, I made it a point to sneak avocados into EVERYTHING he ate. (Dick gasps, amused) Yeah! And of course, nothing ever happens, 'cause he's fulla shit! He just thinks -

Dick: (interjects) Did you...did you tell him this? Like did you spring this plan on him?

Maddox: Oh, no. No.

Dick: So you''ve been slowly building up this really slow-burn...some might call, like, *psychotic* plan? (Maddox laughs) Of slipping avocados in your brother's food? (about to laugh)

Maddox: Oh yeah.

Dick: For how long?

Maddox: Uh, for years I've done this. (Dick laughs hysterically) Like I've just put a little bit of avocado here and there. Just to see what happens!

Dick: Do you have pictures of it?? Do you have pictures of you slipping in...? Like dated, like in Se7en? (cracking up) Like that guy's lair where everything's all -- the urine is all date-stamped?

Maddox: Oh yeah...yeah. (quietly)

Dick: What's up, Sean?

Sean: I have to ask, were the nachos super complex in their ingredients? Was it like, you know, sour cream...

Maddox: Yeah!

Sean: ...and beef, and beans...

Maddox: Right!

Sean: ...and all that kinda -- okay, so there was a -

Maddox: (interjects) There was at LEAST 10 ingredients in these nachos.

Sean: Yeah, like restaurant nachos. It could've been...

Maddox: Restaurant nachos!

Sean: ...ANYTHING.

Maddox: Anything.

Sean: More likely the beef, more likely the -- more likely ANYTHING than the avocado.

Dick: Yeah, but you don't throw up from allergies! Right? Like, you get...

Maddox: No!

Dick: ...your histamines or whatever go crazy.

Maddox: Well, do -

Dick: (interjects) Your feet tingle.

Maddox: You can get nausea, you can get, those are some common things. Not migraines! (annoyed)

Dick: That's just not what I would immediately think.

Maddox: Yeah!

Dick: Like, if I got -- if I threw up I wouldn't think, "Oh, I must be allergic! To beer!"

Maddox: "Must be allergic to SOMETHIN'." Yeah. No, allergies usually cause you to like, sneeze or something. (cracking up)

Dick: Yeah!

Maddox: I DO know people who have allergies to beer, and I didn't believe them! I'm like, "Drink some beer right now. Let's see what happens." And so this girl did, and she IMMEDIATELY started sneezing. I'm like, "That's cool!" (gleeful) (both laugh) I felt great. You're miserable; I'm awesome. Uh -

Dick: (interjects) Man, you have this sick...lust of like, feeding people things that they're not -- that they don't wanna eat or that they CAN'T eat!

Maddox: Yeah...

Dick: This is -- have you ever heard this shit?! Have you ever heard of somebody slipping all this weird food into people's stuff?? *I* haven't!

Maddox: Yeah, and Tabasco too! My brother HATES Tabasco. I always put Tabasco in his food. Um, so... (breaks down laughing) Maybe that's why he hates it! (Dick laughs) But back -- so back to spicy -

Dick: (interjects) That is demented!

Maddox: Yeah, well, fuck it! You know, quit bein' such a fuckin' pansy about everything. Just EAT it. Jesus. (exasperated) (Dick cracks up) Um, so back to spicy food. (chuckling) Do you think this is -

Dick: (interjects) Did you...what was the food like when you grew up?

Maddox: Spicy.

Dick: Like, what was the...? Okay.

Maddox: My mom gave me pepper jam sandwiches when I was a kid. No joke.

Dick: What is that?

Maddox: It's...pepper jam. It's literally jam made out of pepper.

Dick: Oh!

Maddox: It was all -- I just spread it on bread and ate it!

Dick: (chuckling) Oh, okay!

Maddox: Yeah! So, do you think -- here's a question. Do you think that -

Dick: (interjects) How often would you eat...pepper sandwiches?

Maddox: Uh, probably at least once a week.

Dick: Okay.

Maddox: Once or twice a week. Plus I ate her other peppery, spicy foods. Like I' know, I just, I loved it! It was great.

Dick: I'm just diggin' for somethin', 'cause the avocado thing is.....pretty funny.

Maddox: Yeah, it's great! Um, so HERE'S something -- this is interesting -- Penn State University investigated the link between personality traits and affinity for spicy food. Do you think it's personality or do you think it's nature?

Dick: Um...

Maddox: Well, I kinda led that one.

Dick: Wait a minute, wait a minute. What are the options?

Maddox: Do you think you think people are naturally born to not like spicy food, or do you think it's personality?

Dick: I would say...just because of like, my healthy cynicism for people, I would say that they're faking it and that it's a personality thing.

Maddox: It is, actually! There's some truth to both actually, but they say that it's a personality trait. They found -- this is from -- they found that the sensation seekers, or people who enjoyed the thrills of roller coasters, gambling, meeting new people...these are people who like spicy food. [ ]

Dick: Oh, really?

Maddox: Yeah! And they did a survey -

Dick: (interjects) So if someone's a pain in the ass, they don't like spicy food? Is that basically what that's saying? Like if someone who's not fun...

Maddox: Yeah, someone who's not fun doesn't like spicy food!

Dick: Wow! That's a good tip.

Maddox: Boring people like boring food! End of story. So they did a questionnaire; they asked a questionnaire of these people, and these were some of the questions they asked them.

Dick: 'Kay.

Maddox: "I would have enjoyed being one of the first explorers of an unknown land." People who like spicy food answered "yes." So without spicy food, we probably wouldn't even have America!

Dick: (inhales thoughtfully) Oh, man...

Maddox: Right?

Dick: took 20 minutes (Maddox laughs) to answer my first question, which is "Why the hell is this a problem?"

Maddox: Yep.

Dick: And I didn't realize I'd been duped until you just answered the question. Yeah, you're right!

Maddox: Yeeeeeah! (gloating)

Dick: It's a big problem.

Maddox: Alright, baby! Then, uh, they asked another question; they said, "I like a movie where there are a lot of explosions and car chases."

Dick: Cool!

Maddox: People who like spicy food like those types of movies. So -

Dick: (interjects) Uh, is this it just men? And women here?

Maddox: Oh, men AND women, yeah. Who else?

Dick: So...well, it's just -- the questions now are seems like men would all say yes to that. And women would say, "Well, not really."

Maddox: So, no, they asked -- this is actually a REALLY well-done study. I looked at...I couldn't believe how in-depth this study was.

Dick: Hm!

Maddox: But uh,, here's something that's kind of interesting too -

Dick: (interjects) Penn State likes goin' deep. (smiling) Right?

Maddox: What's...I don't know what that reference is.

Dick: Oh, 'cause that guy at Penn State molested all those boys.

Maddox: Oh, my gosh! (hushed tone) No, oh, that's... (cracks up) Awesome. (sarcastic) Uh... (chuckles nervously) No, I'm pretty sure he probably didn't like spicy food. (laughs)

Dick: Ohokay. (apprehensive) I don't...yeah.

Maddox: That's not a... (through giggles)

Dick: I hope not.

Maddox: No. No, he...I guarantee he doesn't. Um, so, [continues quoting PopSci article] "Sensation seeking emerged as a much stronger predictor of spicy food liking than in the previous studies, and it also predicted how often a person ate chili-laden meals. [...] Surprisingly - " Now, this is the part that REALLY kicks ass: "Surprisingly, frequent chili-eaters didn't feel the burn from the capsaicin sample any less than people who ate peppers less often." So what that means is, people who eat spicy food still feel the burn; they just don't give a shit, 'cause they're that awesome.

Dick: Really??

Maddox: Yeah!

Dick: Wow! (in a low voice)

Maddox: We still feel the burn! I ate the world's spiciest pepper a couple months ago. There's a YouTube video on it. [] And I felt the burn -

Dick: (interjects) Of you eating the pepper?

Maddox: Yeah!

Dick: I saw that. Don't you take your shirt off in that video?

Maddox: Yeah, I started sweatin'.

Dick: Yeah. (Maddox chuckles) I don't know if that was the right move for that video. (grinning)

Maddox: Well... (Dick laughs) Probably not. It''s rarely the right move.

Dick: So if you wanna see Maddox take his shirt off and eat the hottest pepper in the world...

Maddox: Yep.

Dick: If you wanna see the hottest shirt taking-off in the world... (gleeful)

Maddox: Yeah! That's uh, that's me. I was doin' it. yeah, these are the people who are scuba diving, they're skydiving -- these are people who are exploring. These are people on the MOON.

Dick: Do you tell your friends this? Do you tell your non-spicy-eating friends all this data?

Maddox: What data...?

Dick: That they're boring?

Maddox: No, 'cause it's impossible to argue -- to reason with them. One of my friends in New York, he CLAIMS his wife is something called a "supertaster"? Have you heard of this before?

Dick: No, man. (dismissively)

Maddox: Yeah!

Dick: I have not heard of that ever. (chuckling)

Maddox: So, she cannot have even a...a granule of spice, because she's a supertaster. (cynical) I'm like... (Dick groans loudly)

Dick: Uggggghhhh, these PEOPLE! (gritting his teeth)

Maddox: Yeah! Yeah.

Dick: Okay.

Maddox: Yeah, it doesn't sound like supertasting to me. That sounds like *special* tasting. You know what I mean? That's...that's stupid. Like, you can't have even a granule of spice? (mocking)

Dick: 'Cause she'll throw a huge fit?

Maddox: Yeah! She'll throw a huge fit! And you know what? You can build your tolerance to it. Just eat it, like Mexican parents! We all need Mexican parents. That's my problem.

Dick: You know, it's...but now I'm thinkin' if there's this correlation to...spiciness and like, adventure-seeking, that -- the spice kinda hurts, right?

Maddox: Yeah!

Dick: Like it BURNS! It feels good!

Maddox: Right!

Dick: Right?

Maddox: It's a good feeling! You actually get a rush of endorphins in your body after you eat spicy food.

Dick: Huh.

Maddox: Yeah!

Dick: I feel like that would correlate with a lot of other stuff too.

Maddox: Sure, it does actually! So there's a scale, it's called the Sensation Seeking Scale. []

Dick: Okay.

Maddox: And so they broke it down into four traits: there's thrill, and that's like...uh, thrill- and adventure-seeking, and that's "desire for outdoor activities involving unusual sensations and risks, such as skydiving, scuba diving, and flying." There's experience-seeking; that refers to things like, you know, social and psychedelic experiences, and going out and meeting people. There is disinhibition; that's a "preference of 'out of control' activities such as wild parties, drinking and sexual variety."

Dick: That's what I was talking about.

Maddox: There you go!

Dick: Yeah.

Maddox: And then the final trait is boredom susceptibility: "intolerance of repetition or boring people, and restlessness in such conditions." These are the people who like spicy food. That's me.

Dick: So, like -- yeah!

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: This is...I hate being informative and not funny. Like, I hate informative things.

Maddox: That's true. (amused)

Dick: Uh, but this is...that's good info!

Maddox: Yeah!

Dick: If someone...if someone doesn't like spicy food, they are not fun.

Maddox: They're boring!

Dick: Scientifically proven.

Maddox: They're assholes.

Dick: Alright, man!

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: I think you're gonna...that's a solid problem!

Maddox: Thank you. Let's, uh -

Dick: (interjects) I think the U.S. men's soccer team needs some spicy food.

Maddox: Damn right they do!

Dick: Okay.....get ready for this. (smiling)

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: This is gonna make your problem look like a joke.

Maddox: Hm'kay. (chuckling)

Dick: 'Kay?

Maddox: Alright.

Dick: Here's my next problem.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: (pauses) Condoms. (Maddox laughs)

Maddox: ('ding!' sound effect)

Dick: Everyone...

Maddox: Correct. (laughing)

Dick: ...everyone hates them.

Maddox: You bet.

Dick: Do you have a boner sound effect?

Maddox: Ohh, no, I -- well...

Dick: Get a boner sound effect for next week.

Maddox: I got an anal sound effect! (fart sound effect) (laughs)

Dick: Nah -- hmm, no. (dismissively) Everyone hates condoms!

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: Men AND women!

Maddox: Yeah! That's true!!

Dick: So don't...I'm not...don't accuse me of being anti-women, er, sexist during this podcast. Everybody hates them.

Maddox: Everybody hates condoms.

Dick: And yet, we're still usin' 'em.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: WHY?

Maddox: Probably to avoid STDs.

Dick: How many people seriously have all these STDs?? Have you ever gotten an STD?

Maddox: No.

Dick: I never have either.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: Uh...don't need 'em!

Maddox: Well, I guess that proves... (cracks up)

Dick: That proves what I'm saying.

Maddox: ...that proves we don't need condoms! (amused) Do you actually have, um -

Dick: (interjects) Look man, I mean... (sighs) Honestly, it ruins -- I spend more time trying to talk chicks out of condoms than I do trying to talk chicks into having sex with me in the first place.

Maddox: Hmm.

Dick: How messed up is that? (Maddox inhales thoughtfully)

Maddox: Very. But for so many different reasons. (chuckling) (Dick laughs) Um...

Dick: What do you mean?

Maddox: Well...first of all, if a girl doesn't feel comfortable having sex with you without a condom, then why push the issue? Just put it on and get it done.

Dick: They're TRAINED! It's like everybody's trained to compulsively put a condom on when you don't really need it. (annoyed) You DON'T really -- I'm saying that!

Maddox: Yeah. (unsure)

Dick: You don't really need it; stop having sex with scumbags.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: That's it. Both ways!

Maddox: Well... (skeptical)

Dick: Stop having sex with...trashy people!

Maddox: Yeah...

Dick: Then you won't get an STD!

Maddox: But this is coming from Dick. Desperation Dick. Let's call, let's call it -

Dick: (interjects) That's offensive. (smiling) (Maddox laughs)

Maddox: Well, you were just saying last weekend you would do anything -- do or say anything to get a blowjob. (laughing)

Dick: Yeah!

Maddox: So that means sometimes you might run into some trashy women. Uh...and also, if it's DARK -

Dick: (interjects) Well, I don't want...I don't want a blowjob from THEM, though. I don't want it from *anybody*!

Maddox: Yeah. (skeptical)

Dick: You know, a GOOD one!

Maddox: Alright. A good one. Sure. (smirks)

Dick: I want that perfect mix of, don't give them often, but you're doin' it now. That's what I -- I wanna ride that razor-thin edge. You know what I'm talking about?

Maddox: (inhales) No.

Dick: I'm not just indiscriminately out there wanting blowjobs.

Maddox: You're just, I, I don't know what you're talkin' about. You want, you want the qual-- how can you tell you're gonna get a quality blowjob? And how can you tell she's not -

Dick: (interjects) I want like, a whole...because! I want like, you know, I want like a Casablanca of blowjobs. (Maddox chuckles) Like, I -- no, I want the Goldilocks, not *too*... (stammers)

Maddox: Uh... (laughs nervously)

Dick: I don't wanna think you've done this too much, and I don't wanna think you've NEVER done this.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: I want you to make me think this one is special!

Maddox: Okay. I'm...TOTALLY on board. 'Cause I've had both, and I know what you're talkin' about. (cracking up)

Dick: You know EXACTLY what I'm talking about.

Maddox: Yup.

Dick: I don't want her to stop in the middle and say, "Is this good? Guys always tell me it's really -- I'm really good." And I'm like, "H'okay, well..." (hesitantly)

Maddox: "Well, it WAS." (laughs)

Dick: Yeah. "It was, 'til you started talking."

Maddox: Yeah! "It was fine..." Uh, I dunno, man. Yeah, but I have... (cracks up) I've experienced both, where it's like, "You don't know what you're doing. Get away from that." And then the other end of it is, "This girl's TOO good at it." Uh, which is -- it's like pornstar good, you know?

Dick: Yeah.

Maddox: Where it's like, "What, wha...*should* I be using a condom? Like, what's goin' on here?"

Dick: Nononononono. Don't you start with that.

Maddox: No. I think condoms with blowjobs are totally pointless. I...I won't stand for that at all.

Dick: Yeah!

Maddox: That's stupid.

Dick: I'd rather just not get ANYTHING.

Maddox: Yeah, I guess. (unsure)

Dick: You know what I'm saying??

Maddox: You know...yeah, but what's the tradeoff here? So, the cost-benefit analysis is...the benefit is, you would have a better sexual experience.

Dick: Yep!

Maddox: Presumably. Right? The cost is, potentially, you're gonna -

Dick: (interjects) NO cost. (Maddox laughs) There's no downside to this, because not everyone...society is not rampant with STDs. It's JUST not.

Maddox: I don't know about that, dude. I've seen some girls where I thought, "Okay, this is pretty questionable." Also, it -

Dick: (interjects) But would you bang them??

Maddox: No!

Dick: No!

Maddox: And I haven't.

Dick: Of COURSE not!!

Maddox: Yeah. (hesitantly)

Dick: That's, I think that...I think everybody has like, a natural level of disgust that protects them from getting an STD.

Maddox: Eh, I dunno, man. STDs are scary, 'cause the cost (cracks up) that you didn't let me finish is that your dick is gonna drip. Uh, it's gonna swell up and drip...

Dick: Mm.

Maddox: ...and you're gonna get pustules, and all sorts of nasty funk. And *then* guess what? You're gonna be the one that THEY'RE worried about.

Dick: You're stuck with that for life then.

Maddox: Yeah! You're stuck with that for LIFE.

Dick: Well...

Maddox: Versus like, a 5-minute experience. And by the way, I'm -

Dick: (interjects) Look man, I don't have all the answers. I'm just saying I would rather...I would rather, uh, drop a dictionary on my dick than have sex with a condom on. (Maddox chuckles) That's all I'm saying. I think everyone can get behind that.

Maddox: I can totally get behind you dropping a dictionary on your dick.

(brief silence)

Dick: Thank you.

Maddox: Yeah. We'll post the video on the website. (laughs) So, do you have any...any actual stats or anything for the number of STDs that people have out there? I've heard it's really high! Like, especially syphilis and gonorrhea are up to like 30 percent of the population.

Dick: (stammers) Yeah, can that possibly be true??

Maddox: Well, I mean, just 'cause -- your experiences are tainted, so you kind of think that your experiences are common just because you have that perspective and empirical evidence. You've never gotten an STD! But ask someone who's HAD one and their, their life is kinda...demolished, right?

Dick: You know what's weird? Um, this friend of mine was telling me about her friend who got herpes.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: And -- this is an example of someone who's trashy -- the girl said, "Well, you know, it's not like her life is over."

Maddox: Well... (unsure)

Dick: I'm like, "Uh, yeah, it kind of is! Like, no one is gonna wanna have sex with you with herpes."

Maddox: Nahh, well, that's not true. I just read an article about this. Um...

Dick: You can't dance AROUND that!

Maddox: No.

Dick: Like those Valtrex commercials? When it's like, "It's only bad for 5 days a month." No, it's bad all month!

Maddox: Is it? I, I mean...

Dick: What would YOU do? Would YOU.....bang someone with herpes?

Maddox: Oh, there's -- that's a loaded question. I mean, it would have to be...A) she'd have to be THE ONE, essentially. She'd have to be a perfect...uh, you know, the perfect girlfriend for me, or whatever.

Dick: She would have to eat spices every day?

Maddox: Eat spices, go skydiving, go to the moon...uh, and discover a new land.

Dick: (over Maddox) She'd have to hate monkeys?

Maddox: She'd have to HATE monkeys, 'cause I *fucking*... (monkeys whooping sound effect) ...hhhhhate monkeys. (under his breath)

Dick: Yeah.

Maddox: But yeah, if she was the perfect one and I saw myself in a long-term thing, then potentially, yeah. 'Cause, uh, I read this thing -

Dick: (interjects) With herpes? (incredulous)

Maddox: Yeah, potentially. I mean, if it's somebody...

Dick: I want you to think about this. I'm gonna let you give a different answer for this.

Maddox: (sighs) Ahh, boy. Yeah.

Dick: 'Cause I'm putting you on the spot, I know.

Maddox: Yeah. (unsure) Okay, you know, my answer is "no." (laughs)

Dick: Yeah! MY answer is "no."

Maddox: No, I read this article about this recently, about a girl who had...she got herpes when she was 22 from a boyfriend that she didn't...HE didn't know he had it, she didn't know he had it, and then she got it. Like, they had sex ONE time or somethin' like that.

Dick: Mmhm.

Maddox: And she got herpes. So then she talked about the rest of her life and her dating experiences; she dated like 10 guys since then, and she had that tearful, uh, confession every time they were about to have sex that she had herpes. And it turned out, like -

Dick: (interjects) Oh, man. Can you imagine getting that...getting that conversation? (in a low voice)

Maddox: I know! It's tough, man, but what do you do? I mean, what do you do, just end your life? Like is that the end of your sex life?

Dick: No, what do you do as the GUY? I'm not imagining it from her point of view, (Maddox smirks) I'm imagining it from...MY point of view.

Maddox: Well, surpri-

Dick: (interjects) Getting told that conversation.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: Like, ugh.

Maddox: Well, surprisingly, a lot of the guys -- like probably about uh, 7 or 8 of 'em -- were okay with it. You know, you have a lower likelihood of contracting it if there's no sore. No open sore.

Dick: Alright. (quietly) That's gross.

Maddox: Yeah! Well, it's your problem, man! But uh, condoms... (sighs)

Dick: Okay, so if there's all these STDs out there?

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: Then I guess...people aren't using condoms! The RIGHT people aren't using them! 'Cause they're goin' around like crazy. Meanwhile, uh...girls who are totally clean, that *I* wanna hook up with, are like, "Yeah, yeah, yeah. You gotta put a condom on." I'm like, "Aggghhh, why?!"

Maddox: That's 'cause they're totally clean! That's how they stay that way.

Dick: Sucks!

Maddox: You know what? That's a test! That's a test. So, if you...if she says "put on a condom," she's already passed the test. And then if you say -

Dick: (interjects) And then -- so we don't have to use one.

Maddox: Well...

Dick: That's what you're saying, right?

Maddox: Yeah... (hesitantly)

Dick: Just say it, and then we can't...then we don't have to.

Maddox: Yeah. Say it, and then we don't have to, yeah. That should be the test right there! There's your solution to the condom problem! Just have them bring it up, and then say, "How about we don't?" And if she's okay with it -- yeah.

Dick: (talking over Maddox) I mean, you, I've been called a scumbag for trying to talk girls out of using them?

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: But I feel like what you're saying is kinda what I'm doing. Like, that's the dance. You insist on wearing one, and insist on me wearing one and I try to talk you out of it so we don't have to. That's the test, okay?

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: You passed the test, and now I gotta fix this feels good.

Maddox: Yeah, but you can't push it too hard. If they, if they don't feel un-

Dick: (interjects) Of course, you can't push it too HARD.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: I'm just saying, you know, you pretend to put it on and then you take it off. (Maddox spits out laughing) What's wrong with that? (grinning)

Maddox: Everything is wrong with that. That is...there's so much wrong with that. Um, no, the condom thing -- actually, it's interesting, most girls...I'M usually the one to say "Hey, uh, lemme get a condom," and then most girls are like, "No, let's not. I'm on the pill." I'm like, "Oh! Alright, well, I guess..."

Dick: Oh, man. You lucky bastard. (in a low voice)

Maddox: Yeah, what is it with you, man?? What are the type of girls you're dating?

Dick: They're ALL, they're...oh no, they're all ABOUT it!

Maddox: They don't wanna give you blowjobs, they don't wanna -- they wanna use condoms...

Dick: No no, they wanna, they -- what are you talkin' about, they don't wanna give blowjobs? Yes they do!

Maddox: Weren't you saying like, what, two episodes ago that you had to persuade... (cracks up) ...that you had to persuade them?

Dick: Yeah!

Maddox: And say anything? (smiling)

Dick: Yeah, of course you...that's -

Maddox: No!

Dick: - that's why you take them out on dates!! (Maddox chuckles) That's what the whole dating thing is!

Maddox: That's...yeah, that's what I'm talkin' about. I don't, like it doesn't -- it's not this like, TRADE, tit for tat.

Dick: You don't take girls OUT? You just...get blowjobs?! What are you TALKIN' about? I don't believe that!

Maddox: Yeah, welcome to *my* world, man.

Dick: Oh, SHUT up! (Maddox laughs) Stop showing off for Sean!

Maddox: Sean's sittin' there with a raging hard-on. (through giggles)

Dick: OH, my GOD. (disgusted)

Maddox: Oh boy. Alright.

Dick: THAT'S what dating is.

Maddox: Uh, a trade for blowjobs. (dryly) That's...

Dick: No! It's like, you know...buttering them up.

Maddox: Oh, gross.

Dick: To get a good one.

Maddox: No...NO way! That's gross, man! That's, that's...that's makin' it vulgar.

Dick: Well, I envy you.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: And your... (sighs)

Maddox: No, I take girls on DATES, yeah! That happens, but I don't's not this expectation that, "Oh, now she's gonna give me a blowjob." Like, a lot of the girls I've dated...uh, I dunno. Maybe I just -- maybe I just pick 'em better! I dunno, who knows, man?

Dick: What are you talk-...I think you're putting words in my mouth that I didn't say. What are you saying? Are you suggesting that I don't get blowjobs?

Maddox: Yeah!

Dick: 'Cause I DO, buddy.

Maddox: Nyeeah. (skeptical)

Dick: Alright?

Maddox: Mmm. You look like a guy who doesn't get blowjobs. (cracks up)

Dick: You're outta your MIND. (playfully annoyed) You like these pictures of my rims? I'll bring you some REAL pictures next week!

Maddox: Gross.

Dick: Yeah. (mischievously)

Maddox: I don't wanna see ANY other kinda rims, coming from you. (laughing) Um...let's move on. Yeah? Next, uh, my next problem?

Dick: Alright. Well, mine's -- first of all, lemme just add, mine is a universal problem.

Maddox: Uhh...

Dick: Everyone's gotta deal with it!

Maddox: ...yeah. You know, I -

Dick: All over the earth!

Maddox: - I will add this; this is actually kind of a sad note. Well, maybe I w-...I don't wanna end your problem on a sad note. We'll uh, we'll just move on. Um...

Dick: Why? What are you gonna say?

Maddox: Well, in Africa, it's a HUGE problem with AIDS. Right? And there are some of these slums -- these villages that are just slums, and I remember watching this, uh, this newscast that went down there and interviewed somebody who said that he regularly has unprotected sex with prostitutes who he knows have HIV.

Dick: Jesus!!

Maddox: Yeah!

Dick: Ohhhkay.

Maddox: So, and they asked him like, "Well, you know this woman has HIV; why are you still having sex with them?" And he says, "Look around you. There is a sewer behind me. It's...the stench makes me wanna throw up EVERY single second of my life." He says, "This is ALL I have to look forward to." (chuckling) So, I guess there is that! Uh...

Dick: Jeez, that's a really sad story.

Maddox: I know, it's a bummer! I didn't wanna end on that note.

Dick: Ehh.

Maddox: But uh, yeah. That's...that's kind of the flip side of it. Sex without a condom is such a powerful motivator that people would even risk getting HIV.

Dick: Yeah, alright. (gloomily)

Maddox: So, there's that. Huge problem, I guess.

Dick: Figure it out!

Maddox: Yep!

Dick: Somebody figure it out. It's not workin'.

Maddox: However, but -

Dick: (interjects) The current thing is not workin'.

Maddox: Yeah, that supports your argument though! I mean, if people are willing to go to such lengths, then condoms know, a problem! I guess.

Dick: Yeah. Alright, what's your next problem?

Maddox: Alright. My next problem is non-apologies! People who don't give apologies, and people who don't give *good* apologies.

Dick: Okay.

Maddox: Right? Don't you have a problem with that? Right??

Dick: Uh, no, because I give them. I've never given a genuine apology.

Maddox: Mm. (knowingly)

Dick: I don't...I THINK like, 90 percent is just saying, "I'm sorry." (flatly) For the sake of it.

Maddox: (annoyed) No, there has to be, I would suspect that you're a really bad apologizer.

Dick: Oh! Uh, what makes you say that?

Maddox: (chuckling) Because you're insincere with *everything*. Every... (cracks up) Every aspect of your life is TOTALLY insincere.

Dick: So what does sincerity have to do with an apology? (Maddox splutters explosively and laughs) Walk me through...

Maddox: THAT'S... (laughs hysterically) Exactly!! That is EXACTLY what the problem is. (giggles more)

Dick: I mean, in a, isn't an apology just something you say to get someone to shut up? (Maddox laughs more)

Maddox: See? So therein lies the problem! NO. If you actually MEAN it, then that's not -- you're not just trying to get them to shut up.

Dick: Okay, gimme an example.

Maddox: An example of what, an apology?

Dick: Yeah!

Maddox: Like a, like a scenario that -

Dick: (interjects) I dunno, you have this problem. What do you, have an apology in mind? Do you have a non-apology in mind?

Maddox: Yeah. So, for example -

Dick: (interjects) Like, I know celebrities are *never* sorry when they apologize.

Maddox: They're rarely sorry. They're trying to cover their ass. Um, here's a non-apology: when you go to a restaurant and you have a bad experience, the restaurant...the manager might come over and say "Oh, well, we're sorry that you feel that way."

Dick: Okay.

Maddox: That's BULLSHIT.

Dick: But that's like a corporate apology.

Maddox: Exactly!! It's a bullshit apology!

Dick: Like, businesses have to.....okay.

Maddox: Yeah!

Dick: Really??

Maddox: Yeah! And I -- for example, if you argue with like, a girlfriend or boyfriend or whatever, they might say, "Well, I'm sorry your feelings are hurt." But...

Dick: Yeah, that's a...that's bullshit. (quietly)

Maddox: ...WHAT is that?? What -- like, let's deconstruct that statement for a second: "I'm sorry that YOUR feelings are hurt."

Dick: Mhm.

Maddox: What are they actually apologizing for?

Dick: They're accusing you of...of being, like, too sensitive.

Maddox: Yeah!

Dick: It's an accusation.

Maddox: So they've shifted the responsibility of being hurt onto...

Dick: On you!

Maddox: ...YOU.

Dick: Yeah.

Maddox: So now you are responsible, A) for your own feelings that they intentionally -

Dick: (interjects) And making them apologize.

Maddox: Yeah, and making them apologize.

Dick: Like, "You're SO hypersensitive."

Maddox: Yeah!

Dick: So you know what I used...I did, um, with the last girl I dated for a while? 'Cause I would always wanna say that.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: 'Cause I did, like, blame her for it?

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: And I would just SAY "sorry" (Maddox smirks) and not add that part, with the "Sorry that your feelings are hurt." (smiling)

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: And it, really tripped her up! 'Cause I think she was still pissed off, but she knew she couldn't take offense to it 'cause it seemed like a real apology.

Maddox: Yeah... (pensively) No, you know, I...people can read this. There's like this innate sixth -- or what are we at, like, seventh, eighth sense now, whatever? That we can -

Dick: (interjects) It's just six. We've...there's only five. (amused)

Maddox: Yeah, but people always say -

Dick: (interjects) Yeah, but the phrase is "sixth sense."

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: Yeah. (smiling)

Maddox: Okay, whatever. So we have this innate ability to tell when someone's bullshitting us with an apology!

Dick: Yeah.

Maddox: And I dated someone for a long time who was THE worst apologizer. THE worst!

Dick: Okay. (laughing)

Maddox: First of all, she would NEVER apologize for anything.

Dick: I think I know who you're talkin' about. (grinning)

Maddox: Yeah. (Dick laughs loudly) Yeah, you do.

Dick: And I, I knew the second I met her that we had that in common. (Maddox sighs exasperatedly)

Maddox: Ohh, you dickheads.

Dick: Like, I could totally tell. (about to laugh)

Maddox: You assholes. (muttering)

Dick: Go -- what would she say?

Maddox: Yeah. Well, first of all, NOTHING. Which was just like, deafening silence. (Dick laughs) Like, you know, uh...especially if we, if we had -

Dick: (interjects) I knew that. (through giggles)

Maddox: Yeah!

Dick: Yeah.

Maddox: I know! And especially if we had a fight where we both, like, mutually may have said something that we, know, upset each other.

Dick: Okay.

Maddox: And so I'll come -- I'll be the bigger man, and I'll offer the apology first, and I'll -

Dick: (interjects) Do you say that? Before you apologize? (Maddox laughs) Do you say, "Look, I'm being the bigger...I'm being the better person here"?

Maddox: No.

Dick: "I'm sorry"?

Maddox: No, not at first. Eventually, yeah, I did. I'm like, "Look, I'm tired of bein' the bigger man!" (irritatedly)

Dick: See, we're all the same! You're acting like I'm the asshole 'cause I give fake apologies, all the time?

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: And just, I give apologies out like I'm throwin' out beads at Mardi Gras.

Maddox: Oh, I know!

Dick: Like, "Sorry! Sorry! I'm sorry!" (offhandedly)

Maddox: Yeah! That's bullshit!

Dick: "Do you mean it?" "Yeah, I really mean it!"

Maddox: Noo, you don't mean it! That's bullshit!

Dick: Who CARES?? Who ca-- nobody ever means it!

Maddox: That's... (annoyed)

Dick: Everyone is a selfish asshole.

Maddox: WRONG. That's bullshit. No, absolutely wrong. Absolutely wrong. Like, if you have know, you fucked up -- let's say you destroyed your friend's car or somethin' like that, and you feel actual deep remorse.

Dick: 'Kay.

Maddox: Right? THAT'S...that's a satisfying apology, when it comes from someplace. Like, a place of remorse.

Dick: Yeah. (unsure)

Maddox: That's what apologies mean!

Dick: I feel like that's really easy to apologize for though. Like, "Sorry I messed up your car, dude!" (nonchalantly) "I'll...I'll pay for it, I guess."

Maddox: (stammers) You know what, dickhead? Like, that would be...the end of your friendship with that person. (Dick laughs) "Hey, sorry I messed up your car, dude. I guess I'll PAY for it, I guess." (mocking)

Dick: What do you WANT?! Like, you want me to write you a soliloquy about how sad I am?? Like, "Ohh, the heavens could not express the depth of my sorrow for messing up your fuckin' CAR." (switches to less dramatic voice) "I'm sorry I messed up your car!" What more do you want?

Maddox: (buzzer sound effect) See, your inability to have any...ANY level of sincerity is the problem.

Dick: That is sincere!! (yelling)

Maddox: You don't have, but you don't have's not a verbose -- the VERBOSITY of it doesn't matter. It doesn't have to be a LONG apology, it just has to be a sincere one. And people -

Dick: (interjects) Okay, lemme try it again.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: And you tell me. This is a...

Maddox: Mhm.

Dick: (imitating a concerned tone) "Hmm...gosh, man. I'm really sorry I messed up your car." (Maddox cracks up) Is that more sincere enough for you?

Maddox: Noo, it's still bullshit! (annoyed)

Dick: What do you want?? (snapping) (Maddox laughs hysterically) What are the words that I have to say to shut... (breaking into a grin)

Maddox: Ohh, don't you dare say that to me! (growling) (Dick laughs) Don't you dare say that!! Guys say that to chicks. I'm like, "What do you want me to say so you'll stop - "

Dick: (interjects) Yeah, 'cause you're bein' a chick! (yelling) You want this -

Maddox: I'M not!

Dick: - you want apologies?? For WHAT?

Maddox: Okay. (dismissively)

Dick: Who CARES?

Maddox: No...'cause you know what? The most -- another type of insincere apology that I hate is...uh, when somebody's just like walking through the mall or whatever and they might walk around you and they say "sorry."

Dick: Yeah, I do that too!

Maddox: Like, why are you saying...why are you saying "sorry"?! That's an insincere, bullshit little thing. Say "excuse me," fine!

Dick: 'Cause you INCONVENIENCED them.

Maddox: Well, just say "excuse me"! That's fine. You -

Dick: (interjects) But what if you already did it?

Maddox: Well, if you bumped into them, yeah. You say "sorry" and then you move on.

Dick: Okay... (puzzled)

Maddox: But I have seen fights start because someone DIDN'T say "sorry."

Dick: You gotta say "sorry"!

Maddox: Exactly!

Dick: You just have to SAY it! These are words that you have to say in society.

Maddox: Well, yeah! But you should...there should be some sincerity to it. So I'll -- lemme tell you why this is a problem.

Dick: Wait a minute! Nononono, don't move on yet.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: So you're at a movie theater, right?

Maddox: Right?

Dick: And you're getting up to go to the bathroom.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: Do you say -- is it okay if I'm like, "Oh, sorry"?

Maddox: Yeah, that's fine.

Dick: "Sorry, I gotta go."

Maddox: 'Cause you are genuinely inconveniencing them.

Dick: (stammers) That...they gotta move their legs? (incredulous)

Maddox: Or you say "excuse me." "Excuse me" or "sorry," either one is fine.

Dick: Okay, so THAT "sorry" is okay; what kind are you talking about that's bullshit? In the mall?

Maddox: Like uh, like for example, if somebody, if you're in a grocery store and you're just walking down the aisle.

Dick: 'Kay.

Maddox: And you walk around somebody and you say "sorry." Like, why would you say "sorry"? What are you...what are you apologizing for?

Dick: And that bothers you?!

Maddox: Yeah!

Dick: WHY?

Maddox: Because it's's just a bullshit... (stammers) It desensitizes people to A) saying it and B) hearing it.

Dick: Okay. See, this is a -

Maddox: So it just becomes this THING.

Dick: - this is a great topic, because I, like your ex-girlfriend, don't give a shit about "sorrys."

Maddox: Yeah. (dryly) I know! Oh, I know.

Dick: And it, REALLY feel like the word is cheapened.

Maddox: Yeah!

Dick: And some -- and people are lying to you when they apologize...

Maddox: Well...

Dick: a grocery store.

Maddox: So, "sorry" is such a powerful thing. Like, apologizing. 'Cause what you LOSE is a little bit of your...

Dick: Dignity.

Maddox: ...ego.

Dick: Oh, 'kay. (cracks up)

Maddox: Your have to like, swallow -- yeah, sure. Not dignity. (derisively) Come on. But you have to -

Dick: (interjects) That's what I...that's how I think! (smiling)

Maddox: You have to swallow a little bit of your pride!

Dick: Okay.

Maddox: And this is such an important thing because -- I'm gonna take you back to April 1st, 2011. Or 2001, rather. So April 1st, 2001...uh, or maybe it is 2011!

Dick: (talking over Maddox) April Fools' Day!

Maddox: Yeah, it was April Fools' Day!

Dick: 'Kay.

Maddox: This was uh, 2001. There was an incident called the Hainan Island incident, where a U.S. spy plane bumped into a Chinese fighter. So, we had some spy planes over off the coast of China. [ ]

Dick: Okay.

Maddox: And what would you say...what would you say if we intercepted a spy plane, say, from Russia, off of our coast -- off the coast of California -- and there were, uh...we sent up some fighter jets to escort them away from our airspace.

Dick: Okay.

Maddox: And they clipped one of our fighters, and our fighter went down into the ocean.

Dick: And crashed?

Maddox: And crashed, yeah. What would you -

Dick: (interjects) Well, they owe us a...they owe us a plane!

Maddox: Right.

Dick: I'm sending them the bill!

Maddox: There you go! They owe us a plane. And the pilot died, by the way.

Dick: Well, I can't fix that!

Maddox: that happened in China. We... (cracks up)

Dick: Whoa, we bumped the guy -- we killed the Chinese guy? (amused)

Maddox: We killed a Chi-...there are different accounts of what happened, but they essentially...wings -

Dick: (interjects) Someone messed up.

Maddox: Yeah, someone messed up.

Dick: Okay.

Maddox: One of the wings was clipped; the Chinese fighter went down and crashed.

Dick: I feel like they should send me to China to apologize. (Maddox chuckles) 'Cause I'm GREAT...

Maddox: The worst. (amused)

Dick: ...I'm GREAT at apologies.

Maddox: Aw, the worst. You are absolutely the worst. I'm a great apologizer, you're a terrible apologizer.

Dick: Okay, let's -- Sean,, everybody... (stammers) Here's the apology.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: We each are gonna apologize, and then somebody's gonna decide who had the better apology here.

Maddox: H'okay. (laughing)

Dick: Okay?

Maddox: Great. (sarcastic) (suddenly raises voice) ALREADY this is flawed, because neither of us are being sincere about anything! Like, you have to apologize about a real thing.

Dick: I'm...VERY sincere. (Maddox bursts out laughing)

Maddox: You're not! (through giggles)

Dick: "China?"

Maddox: You are the least sincere!

Dick: "China, I'm sorry...we messed up your plane and killed your guy." (hesitating) (Maddox snickers) "We will buy you a better plane." (Maddox laughs harder)

Maddox: "Go fuck - "

Dick: (interjects) "I'm sorry." (flatly)

Maddox: "Go fuck yourself. Ni hao. Go fuck yourself. Zai jian." (laughs more)

Dick: Okay, now you...let's see YOUR master...let's see your sincere apology! That sounded sincere as SHIT, dude.

Maddox: That DID sound sincere as literal shit. (Dick scoffs) Um...

Dick: Go ahead!

Maddox: Alright.

Dick: Let's hear it, master! (disdainful)

Maddox: You want a sincere apology?

Dick: Yeah!

Maddox: How about this, how about this: "We are sorry...we regret the unfortunate incident that happened. We're sorry for the loss of life, and we're sorry that this cost you so much money, and we hope that it never happens again. We'll try our best to make sure it never happens again."

Dick: Ahh, see, now you're gettin' shaky! (smiling)

Maddox: That's a fuckin' sincere -- nope!

Dick: Now you messed up!

Maddox: No, that's not a mess-up!! 'Cause that's the...that's the element that makes it a good apology, is that you are...sincerely trying to avoid making the mistake again.

Dick: Eh, I think uh...alright.

Maddox: Yeah! So let's go back to this timeline: April, uh -

Dick: (interjects) So what happened?

Maddox: A U.S. Navy spy plane involved in a collision with a Chinese fighter jet...spy plane makes an emergency landing; the Chinese fighter pilot dies. So we had 21 people aboard this plane -- or maybe it was 24 -- they landed safely in Chinese airspace. So even though we clipped the wing of one of their fighters, they still let us land in their airspace. Right?

Dick: 'Kay.

Maddox: So...April 3rd, "Chinese president Jiang Zemin says that the United States must 'bear full responsibility'; asks for an apology and calls on Bush to halt all spy flights near China's coast."

Dick: Alright.

Maddox: Is that unreasonable?

Dick: I mean...uh, yeah?

Maddox: I mean, yeah.

Dick: Did we do it?

Maddox: We're not gonna stop spying, of course. But he asked...he asked Bush to apologize. April 4th -

Dick: (interjects) Nah, you can't do that!

Maddox: What do you mean, you can't do that?

Dick: Make our president apologize?

Maddox: Ohh, of COURSE not! (mocking)

Dick: 'Cause some pilots messed up?

Maddox: Oh, GOD. Yeah! No, it's not the pilots messed up! We were in their airspace. We had... (cracks up) We had a spy craft in their airspace and one of their pilots died because of us.

Dick: I...look, I don't know all the details? (Maddox laughs)

Maddox: Yeah, I'm TELLING you the details.

Dick: For the reason the dude died? Yeah, but you weren't up there in the sky! I mean, what are they, dickin' around in the plane? Were they goin' like, "Ohh, check this out! I'm gonna freak this guy out"?

Maddox: (stammers) I mean, it doesn't matter; we were in their airspace. We were over there. We shouldn't have been -- I mean, we got caught...

Dick: Alright.

Maddox: ...and so somebody died because of it! So, Secretary of State Colin Powell at the time says Washington has "nothing to apologize for." (chuckling)

Dick: Yeah!

Maddox: And refers to the crew as "detained." So then April 4th -

Dick: (interjects) Look, you don't tell us to apol-- you don't tell someone to apologize! That's a dick move on THEIR part!

Maddox: They -

Dick: (interjects) Have you ever tried to say that with your girlfriend??

Maddox: YES!

Dick: "Hey, uh, baby? You need to apologize for this."

Maddox: Absolutely!

Dick: Ohoho! (derisively)

Maddox: And I shouldn't have to! Because if I have to, I've already lost that war.

Dick: Get... (incredulous) Yeah.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: Get outta here, telling someone to apologize.

Maddox: No, that's bullshit!! Just fuckin' man up and apologize. I've lost friends 'cause they wouldn't apologize. It's an important thing. You gotta fuckin' man up! You have to feel remorse for something that you've done.

Dick: See, this irrational...

Maddox: NO.

Dick: ...this irrational love of apologies is why I just do it compulsively and immediately and without any remorse at all. Because it just -

Maddox: (interjects) And they mean ABSOLUTELY nothing.

Dick: It...I will totally dupe you every time!

Maddox: No you won't! No you won't.

Dick: I, I'm...I feel like we gotta test this. (grinning)

Maddox: No, we don't have to test it. So, the Chinese government...even though we crashed one of their fighter planes, even though we killed one of their pilots, even though we landed in their airspace, they said, "We'll give you your plane back; just apologize." Because in Chinese culture, and many cultures around the world, losing face means something. Like, you will lose a little bit of face -- you will lose a little bit of your ego, or your...your pride by apologizing. And, and -

Dick: (interjects) Yeah, but that's very aggressive!

Maddox: No, it's not!! (irritated) Apology?! How is that aggressive?

Dick: "Do what I - "

Maddox: (interjects) Aggressive would be, "We're gonna fuckin' INVADE you. We're gonna put sanctions against you."

Dick: But this is a step towards that! Because what he's saying is, "Do what I tell you to do and we'll give you something."

Maddox: Yes! It's pride! Swallow your pride, America! Apologize. So April 4th: "Jiang, leaving for a South American tour, repeats the call for an American apology. The U.S. spurns the demand."

Dick: Good!

Maddox: This is from The Washington Post, by the way. And then April 5th: "Bush expresses regret..." Finally! "Bush expresses regret for the loss of the Chinese pilot; says he does not want the dispute to destabilize U.S.-China relations." And by the way -

Dick: (interjects) You know what he shoulda done? Can I...can I interrupt for a second?

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: He should've said, "You know what? We're sorry. We're gonna fly the pilot's family to Disneyland." (Maddox laughs) "Fuck you, don't have Disneyland!" (smiling) That's what he shoulda...that would've been a GREAT...that's the kind of apology that I wanna see.

Maddox: Yeah. (skeptical) Well, except they do have Disneyland. So...

Dick: They do?

Maddox: Yeah. In Hong Kong.

Dick: Probably sucks, though.

Maddox: Uh, I dunno! I dunno, I've never been there. So...uh, so he expresses regret and then he says that he doesn't want this dispute to destabilize U.S.-China relations. And by the way, we did 16 billion dollars of trade with them that year! So this is what's at stake here, 16 BILLION dollars and 106 billion on China's side. So then April 7th -- by the way, why is this going on so long?? April 7th: "Washington rebuffs - "

Dick: (interjects) 'Cause that's these people's jobs! These morons that are running the country? Their job is to protract these dumb things to make it look like they're busy.

Maddox: This is like, two words that Washington won't say, that would...that's potentially going to destabilize our economy!

Dick: Nah...

Maddox: This is fucking STUPID.

Dick: Nobody's gonna stop buying Chinese crap -

Maddox: No!

Dick: - because the president didn't apologize.

Maddox: They were talkin' about sanctions! America was talkin' about sanctions and China was talkin' about sanctions. This is back in uh, in 2001. April 7th: "Washington rebuffs ANOTHER Beijing demand for an apology." April 8th: "Dick Cheney insists Washington will not apologize over the incident." April 9th: "Jiang Zemin, on a tour of Latin America, repeats Beijing's demand for an apology."

Dick: Okay.

Maddox: April 11th: FINALLY, after 10 full days, finally they get an apology. And they phrase it in kind of a bullshit way. They said that the U.S. is "very sorry" to the family that the pilot died; they're "very sorry" that the U.S. plane had no verbal clearance when it entered Chinese airspace and landed. Finally, after...for no reason, almost 2 weeks we escalated this thing into an international incident, when all they had to say is "I'm sorry." That's all the Chinese government was looking for.

Dick: I got a longer time that I've made somebody wait. For an apology.

Maddox: Oh, I'm SURE.

Dick: Than 10 days. (smiling)

Maddox: I'm sure!

Dick: know her. Uh, I broke up with this girl 'cause I made a joke about her smoking.

Maddox: Oh, I know who you're talkin' about! (cracking up) This is great.

Dick: And...yeah. And uh, no, 'cause you know how I break up. It's: "You're DONE."

Maddox: Mmm.

Dick: "You're dead to me."

Maddox: Not true.

Dick: "Deleted."

Maddox: Not at all. You're very...

Dick: Oh yeah, no! I don't...I don't stay in contact with girls that I'm not talkin' to anymore!

Maddox: You are in contact with a girl you're not talkin' to anymore *today.*

Dick: Oh, dude! Well, that -- yeah, that's like a one-off.

Maddox: Okay. (laughing)

Dick: No, I mean, we're... (stammers) Yeah, we dated a long time ago.

Maddox: Okay. Yeah.

Dick: And we were friends -- then we were friends before that, though.

Maddox: Sure.

Dick: I mean, what...but, right? As a rule...

Maddox: As a rule. In general.

Dick: ...I don't do like a wind -- I don't do a wind-down, like, debriefing of what everyone messed up in this relationship. It's like, "Okay, it's over! Bye!" (Maddox chuckles)

Maddox: Yeah. Well, I mean, that is how you handle it, yes.

Dick: Yeah!

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: So I see this girl after no contact, uh...eight months later. And I think one of the first things I said to her was like, "Oh, sorry about that cigarette joke."

Maddox: Ohh, wow!

Dick: Yeah.

Maddox: Eight MONTHS it took, huh?

Dick: Eight months. Yeah. (amused)

Maddox: Yeah!

Dick: So China is...they got it easy.

Maddox: This is finally, FINALLY when Bush finally apologized; here's the apology. Here's all it took. [ plays audio clip of former president George W. Bush]

President Bush: This has been a difficult situation for both our countries. I know the American people join me in expressing sorrow for the loss of life of the Chinese pilot. Our prayers are with his wife and his child.

Dick: (talking over clip) I miss this guy.

[clip ends]

Maddox: (giggling) Oh, DICK.

Dick: I miss his voice.

Maddox: No, what a g-...what a dumbass.

Dick: I miss his goofy, like, cartoon voice. (smiling)

Maddox: Yeah, it was a goofy, like, idiot voice. Moron. It -- that's all it took.

Dick: You're're so anti-Bush? Really?

Maddox: Oh, absolutely. He's a moron! He's an idiot. He got us into the -

Dick: (interjects) I don't think he's think he's a moron, though??

Maddox: ABSOLUTELY. Yeah, he's a moron!

Dick: I don't think someone can elevate to that position in this country and be a moron!

Maddox: Oh, excuse me, he is absolutely a moron. He had...he got elevated to that position through nepotism! He got everything in his life through nepotism. Come on, he's an idiot! The "axis of evil" speech was THE single biggest diplomatic international blunder, probably.

Dick: I mean, yeah, but you realize it's's like a team of people crafting these speeches and these policies.

Maddox: Right.

Dick: It's not HIM. Like, he's a punching bag for...THEM. For the team.

Maddox: And who, who put together that team?

Dick: Probably him! (Maddox laughs) But what...?

Maddox: Oh, so therefore... (giggling) There we go! Back, circle...

Dick: I don't know, I just don't buy into the whole like, "Bush is an idiot" mantra.

Maddox: (raising his voice) He took almost two weeks and elevated this thing to an international incident, lost a lot of diplomacy, lost a lot of credibility, and then ended up apologizing anyway! What did we gain by holding off this apology?

Dick: I dunno, I'm more interested in why YOU'RE fixated on fake apologies.

Maddox: Because it causes problems. And this is an example of a real-world problem where billions of dollars were at stake, because someone wouldn't apologize.

Dick: Nyeeah... (skeptical)

Maddox: It's a huge problem! I've lost friends over non-apologies. I stopped talking to my own family for a long time because they wouldn't apologize.

Dick: What's the last thing they didn't apologize for? Your family?

Maddox: Oh, it's just...I don't even know. I don't even -- it's been resolved now, but it know, it's a serious thing! If you don't feel remorse for what you've done, then fuck off!

Dick: Yeah, but what if you just don't? What, Sean?

Maddox: Yeah, Sean's gotta say somethin'.

Sean: If you get busted, will you apologize for the avocado? (Maddox snorts and laughs)

Dick: Yeah!

Maddox: Absolutely not. Because that's bullshit! There's no, there's know, there's nothing goin' on there. There's no.....allergy.

Dick: I think it's just something you say to make people feel better.

Maddox: YES, but it has to be sincere! Otherwise it doesn't count.

Dick: Yeah, but doesn't your desire to make them feel better -- isn't *that* sincere? Like if I...let's say I'm watching...I dunno. Let's say I'm watching my girlfriend's dog, and somehow it gets all its hair dyed a weird color.

Maddox: 'Kay.

Dick: 'Cause someone thought it would be funny.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: Okay? If I'm not sorry I did it but, like, I just want her to kinda get over it?

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: Isn't that the s-...isn't that sincere?

Maddox: Eh, no. You want them to feel better; however, you have to find a way to sincerely apologize. Even if you don't care about the dog's hair color. So for example, you have to say, "I'm sorry that I...that I let that happen." That's a sincere -

Dick: (interjects) But I did it.

Maddox: Huh?

Dick: But I did it.

Maddox: (stammers) "I'm sorry I did it." Then you have to apologize for doing it!

Dick: But that's a -- like, that's not sincere!

Maddox: And then follow up with, "I'll never do it again." That should be sincere.

Dick: So, moralize?

Maddox: (laughing) Don't -- no! I'm not saying lie! That's the...that's the problem! What aren't you getting? Just don't lie! Say it sincerely.

Dick: Yeah, but they're not the...but to not lie is to, I'm not really sorry! I'm sorry that you're so *upset* by it, and I just want this to be over.

Maddox: That's a bullshit apology!

Dick: It's like a magic word that makes people not sad anymore!

Maddox: No, it's not magic, dude. (exasperated) It's not. You have to actually mean it, otherwise it means nothing. It comes from nowhere.

Dick: *I* don't need that, though! Like, I just need 'em to say it.

Maddox: Well, I know, because your...your fucked-up mind thinks everyone works the same way you do. You think -

Dick: (interjects) No, it's not fucked up, and I'll tell you why! Because I just need them to acknowledge that it pissed me off. I don't need you to feel BAD about it; I just need you to say, "Yeah, I can tell you're pretty pissed off about this!" (chuckling)

Maddox: Yeah... (skeptical)

Dick: And I'm like, "Yeah, I am! Fine."

Maddox: Okay.

Dick: "I can see that you...can see that."

Maddox: And what would you hope to come of that?

Dick: I don't know!

Maddox: That they would never do that again?

Dick: Mmm, I don't...yeah, but not...I don't hold people to that high of a standard. Like, I think that they probably just messed up.

Maddox: Well, yeah...

Dick: I don't think they have that kinda control over it.

Maddox: Well, if it's something that's controllable -- like for example, alcoholism. I've known people who are alcoholics and they keep relapsing and they keep relapsing, and they keep apologizing, or they're gambleholics or whatever. They -

Dick: (interjects) Are you talkin' about me? (Maddox laughs) With the alcohol?

Maddox: No, You're, you're're a functional -

Dick: (interjects) 'Cause I'm fine!

Maddox: (laughs more) 'Cause that...sure! You SEEM fine. (teasing)

Dick: Yeah.

Maddox: You're a functional alcoholic. But yeah -

Dick: (interjects) I want an apology for that. (smiling) (Maddox laughs)

Maddox: I'm sorry. (slowly; deliberately)

Dick: Great! (amused)

Maddox: There! There we go, we resolved it.

Dick: And you know why?? I'll tell you why I accept that! Because it still hurts you to say! And like, even if you don't mean it, it still feels like you're degrading yourself by apologizing.

Maddox: You have to swallow -

Dick: Even if you don't mean it.

Maddox: You have to swallow your pride.

Dick: THAT'S why I think it counts.

Maddox: Do you think that pride has any actual value in life?

Dick: makes you FEEL good.

Maddox: Think about it! Think about what you're about to say.

Dick: Yeah!

Maddox: Do you think pride has value?

Dick: Va-...only insofar as it makes you feel good about yourself, which is the *entire* point of life. I think it's stupid when people, like, blow big opportunities or are assholes out of pride, BUT I can't say it's illogical because it makes you feel good! Like yeah, everything else in life you do is...what makes you feel good; you gotta find a balance.

Maddox: Pride has a lot of value, and for some people that's all they have. So if you make somebody swallow their pride it really means something.

Dick: Yes!!

Maddox: 'Cause you're trading something that has...that's worth more than money.

Dick: I think THAT'S more important than actually being sorry, is making them sacrifice pride to say it.

Maddox: Well, that' know, they're -

Dick: (interjects) You know what? I had this sudden realization that...that we sound like COMPLETE whack jobs when we're talking about apologizing like this.

Maddox: Why is that?

Dick: I don't know! I just had that sudden feeling. I don't know if it's gonna be true.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: We gotta check the comments after this.

Maddox: Oh, I can't wait to read the comments after this. (amused)

Dick: But I think somehow both of us are WAY off on this topic.

Maddox: Oh, I think I -- I think one of us is way off, and I think it's that side of the table. Um, but I can't -

Dick: (interjects) Yeah, but everyone does what I do! Everyone gives fake apologies!

Maddox: No!! You're, that's...that's your fucked-up, like, perspective because you think everybody thinks like you, but we don't! We don't. That's you.

Dick: I don't think they THINK like I do, I think they just DO it. Like I don't think they realize they're doing it, I think they just kinda say, "Oh, sorry!"

Maddox: No! I am...I am evidence that you're wrong. I give sincere apologies when I actually mean it, and I say that I'll never do it again. That's a sincere apology! That's all you should do. And you shouldn't cheapen it by saying "oh, sorry" if you, like...I dunno, if you're getting gas or something and you don't have exact change. That's not an apology, you don't have to apologize for that.

Dick: I apologize to the gas machine. (Maddox chuckles) Just to like, keep my apologizing chops up?

Maddox: Okay.

Dick: Like if I put the card in too hard I'm like, "Oh, sorry about that, buddy." (Maddox laughs)

Maddox: Hopeless. (smiling) Alright.

Dick: Alright, what's our problems? I had...I had the U.S. Soccer Team -- the U.S. Men's Soccer Team, because the women always win the World Cup. Know what, I mean, I don't really care about that, but. (Maddox snorts) The men's...

Maddox: (laughing) Okay. Just dust that under the rug!

Dick: I'll get into -- I can get into that.

Maddox: I'm sure.

Dick: On another episode. The U.S. Men's Soccer Team -- or just the U.S. Sucks at Soccer.

Maddox: Yeah. The U.S. Sucks at Soccer. Is that how you wanna -

Dick: (interjects) Yeah, 'cause we do as a country!

Maddox: Sure.

Dick: Yeah!

Maddox: Okay!

Dick: That's the...that's the problem: The U.S. Sucks at Soccer.

Maddox: Should we...should we um, call it "football" on the website, I think?

Dick: No!!

Maddox: Probably? So the rest of the world can know -

Dick: No, it's SOCCER.

Maddox: Alright. Soccer, fine.

Dick: I'm not spelling it with a 'u' or an umlaut! (Maddox chuckles) Or whatever!

Maddox: Put your foot down.

Dick: Yeah!

Maddox: No umlauts.

Dick: It's soccer. I want us to be so good at the next World Cup that everyone has to call it soccer. (Maddox snickers) Yeah, we win the World Cup and we're like, "Eff you! Now everyone has to call it soccer for 4 years! That's the game."

Maddox: Hell -- I'm on board. Yeah, I'm on board with that 100 percent.

Dick: It's us versus the WHOLE world.

Maddox: Correct. ('ding!' sound effect) Absolutely.

Dick: Okay, and the other one was Condoms. Because everyone hates them.

Maddox: Alright, so -

Dick: (interjects) And I don't think they're necessary. I don't think everyone should be so crazy for condoms like they are.

Maddox: Yeah, maybe you're right. Uh, my problems are People Who Can't Eat Spicy Food and Non-Apologies. So...

(closing riff starts)

Dick: Alright, head to the website, to vote!

Maddox: That's right, and we'll read your comments next week! Thanks for listening.

(closing riff)