Biggest Problem in the Universe - Episode 32

Transcription courtesy of: Laurie Foster

(Theme riff)

Maddox: Welcome to the Biggest Problem in the Universe. I'm Maddox. With me is Dick Masterson.

Dick: Heyyyy, what's up buddy? How's it going?

Maddox: And Sean, our audio engineer.

Sean: Assholes! (Maddox and Dick laugh)

Maddox: Sean, what can you possibly be referring to? (Dick cackles) I don't know. I don't know. Well, let's…

Dick: What a week. We had a great week. Do you wanna talk about the week first, or do you want to talk about the voting?

Maddox: Dick, let's talk about the week first.

Dick: Let's talk about the week first.

Maddox: It was very exciting. We recorded our first ever live "The Biggest Problem in The Universe" show at YouTube studios in Los Angeles, and the turnout was incredible. Excellent turnout. Which…

Dick: (interjects) Thank you to everybody who came out. You guys were awesome.

Maddox: You're welcome. And…(laughs)…well, I did come out!

Dick: Yeah, you did. (Maddox giggles)

Maddox: And we had 100% turnout rate. Everybody who RVSPed…and then we had a few extras as well, which is unheard of. Usually when people RVSP to things, they flake.

Dick: Yeah.

Maddox: And they did not for our show.

Dick: Yeah.

Maddox: They showed up on time. They left on time. And then a few stuck around for drinks afterwards.

Dick: In fact, the only problem with the audience was that Maddox was going to give them all t-shirts to thank them for coming, except he left all of the t-shirts at his house before we went to the studio to tape, so everybody got nothing.

Maddox: Yeah. There's a big stack of 'em to your right, Dick. They're right over there. (Dick laughs) Yeah, well, you know, um…that gives people an incentive to come to the next show and me an incentive to bring them, so we'll see if I remember.

Dick: Look, it was an awesome show. We didn't know how it was gonna go when we went into it.

Maddox: I…I did.

Dick: Well, you did, of course.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: It was a new format and I think the people at YouTube had their minds blown, quite honestly. Like, I'm speaking frankly. That's not hyperbole.

Maddox: I received a lot of compliments from really jaded people. And that's the best…those are the best type of people to receive compliments from. If they're really jaded, they've seen it all, they've done it all. There were other productions in the space that whole week, that whole month. And they said ours ran the smoothest by far. We actually wrapped on time. We said 4 PM out, and we finished at 4 PM. Which is another thing that's fucking unheard of. We're a well-oiled machine, baby! We nailed it!

Dick: And it was awesome.

Maddox: Yeah. And the show's coming…we're going to be posting the show on the website. We're not sure if we're gonna do it in lieu of a regular episode…probably in addition to the regular episode.

Dick: Yeeeeah, I don't know.

Maddox: Because it's a video format. And the guests were incredible. This was an awesome, awesome show all around. You guys are gonna love it. So, probably look for that the first or second week of January. Probably the second.

Dick: We gotta edit it. I can't wait to do that. And I'm gonna say…I'm gonna call it now. I think there's gonna be something controversial…in the show.

Maddox: Oh yeah? (giggles)

Dick: Yeah, I'm not gonna say what I think it's gonna be. (grins)

Maddox: Uh-huh.

Dick: I'm just gonna say right now. We're gonna get more into it as we approach the live show, but there's something controversial about it.

Maddox: Yeah. Speaking of controversial, Dick!!!!! (yells) (Dick laughs) Last week, "Hunger"…"Hunger" won.

Dick: Ohohohhhhhhh!!! Yeah!!!

Maddox: The biggest…it didn't win, but it was the one with the most votes.

Dick: Oho!! Okay. (laughing)

Maddox: Yeah. I'm tired of explaining that.

Dick: Can I have a minute?

Maddox: Yeah, uh…

Dick: I don't wanna…you know I usually play my song.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: But I don't want to do that this time. I wanna play a totally different song.

(Upbeat Christmas piano music starts)

Dick: 'Cause it's Christmas.

Maddox: (laughs) Awesome.

(Woman starts singing: "We wish you a Maddox lost-mas, we wish you a Maddox lost-mas… (Maddox: Fuck you!!) (Dick cackles) We wish you a Maddox lost-mas, (Maddox: What does that mean?!?!) ( Dick: I don't know) 'cause his problems were dumb. Let's hope that Sean won't delete it again. (Maddox: Yeah, thanks Sean.) (Maddox and Dick laugh) That's right, Maddox lost-mas, and Dick won again.")

(Sound effect: "Wrong" buzzer)

Maddox: Bunch of horseshit. That fucking song was.

Dick: Happy Maddox lost-mas.

Maddox: Yeah. That doesn't make sen…what does that even mean, lost-mas?

Dick: I dunno, dude. It's Christmas. (giggles)

Maddox: Yeah. Thanks. Real in the spirit, Dick. (Dick laughs) This is what I get! This is what I get instead of gifts from my friends! Nothing. Which is, coincidentally what you're getting. And then followed by "Audio Engineers Deleting Podcasts"…uh, Dick, your impromptu problem that you brought in last week REALLY scored well. Uh, it's the second highest problem. Sean, do you have any comments on that problem?

Sean: Look, I held off…(Maddox and Dick crack up loudly) I held off Dick's impending cirrhosis at least another day, so you're welcome.

Dick: Alright, alright.

Maddox: Yeah. (laughing) And then followed by, "Gourmet Dog Food", which scored in the negatives.

Dick: Good. 'Cause it wasn't a problem.

Maddox: You don't think…you guys don't think it's a problem.

Dick: No.

Maddox: So, Dick. I actually…

Dick: Wait a minute, I have more. I didn't want to bring up the Sean thing, but I have a bunch of comments on it, since he was…

Sean: Oh, no. (in the background)

Dick: Yeah, I just wanna read them real quick. Jay McDonald: "Hearing that Sean deleted the podcasts was one of the funniest things I've heard on this show so far, and this show is hilarious every week." Alright, that's complimentary. David Lugo: "Also, the title on the website should read, "New episodes every Tuesday unless Sean deletes them."" (Maddox laughs) Craig Cunningham: "At least all the people asking for Sean to bring in a problem got their wish." Rivanita Stankaviscious: "I don't understand how the podcast was lost. Deleted files go into the Recycle Bin or trash unless you press shift+delete…" and then a bunch of other technical stuff.

Maddox: Yeah.

Sean: Not when you delete them directly from Pro Tools.

Maddox: From Pro Tools, yeah.

Sean: And I'm not talking about the timeline.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: So that's what happened.

Sean: Yeah.

Dick: 'Cause everyone was asking.

Maddox: Yeah. 'Cause Pro Tools doesn't have some kind of delete buffer if you do a permanent delete.

Sean: No, look. If you…I'll tell you really quickly how I did it.

Dick: Okay.

Maddox: Okay. (giggles)

Sean: I pulled the tracks into a mix session. I have different mix templates I use, 'cause things are routed and certain compressors and EQs and all that shit are there, bla bla bla.

Dick: Oh, okay.

Sean: Anyway, um…pulled it into the timeline, got up for a second, thought that they were still the old ones, because what happens is that the session saves every audio file, so you get this gargantuan session. So I don't need the old ones, 'cause they're already mixed down. I have all the tracks elsewhere.

Dick: Uh-huh.

Sean: So, I uhh…I highlighted them, I hit "delete", like you would.

Maddox: (scoffs) Yeah.

Sean: That doesn't delete them, though.

Dick: I guess you would.

Maddox: We got this screenshot.

Sean: Then I know two keyboard shortcuts that no engineer in his right mind should know.

Maddox: Yeah.

Sean: And it's "Select Unused" and "Delete Unused".

Dick: No, don't tell them!! We don't want to spread this poison!! (Sean laughs)

Maddox: Yeah. Other audio engineers…

Sean: That's what I did. And in three seconds, they were gone.

Dick: Oh, man. Brutal.

Maddox: Yeah, you know, that person who said that they were asking for Sean to bring in a problem. Uh, technically Sean didn't bring in a problem; Sean was the problem, so…Sean, we will want you to bring in a problem at some point in the future when your crazy schedule dies down.

Sean: Well this one isn't, you know, in the box yet, so. (Maddox and Sean laugh)

Maddox: Well, that's true.

Dick: This is the last comment. And I don't want to bring it up again after. Kenny X. Stiles says, "Dick, I don't know if there's a support group for audio engineers who delete audio files, nor do I think one should exist. One fuckup for 31 episodes is pretty acceptable considering Maddox's Dick Versus Dick segment proves how much of a flaky, contradicting assclown you can be…" I should have read that one first.

Maddox: (laughing) You should have read it.

Dick: "You're getting close to more fuckups than Bush…" blablablabla. I think…the point is, it is definitely NOT acceptable to delete 1 out of 31 podcasts.

Maddox: Oookay.

Dick: And I don't want…I know you agree with that, Sean.

Maddox: Okay.

Dick: I don't want it to seem like that's…like you think it's acceptable to do that, right?

Sean: No. And I've never done it with anything important, so…

Dick: Oh, fuck you…

Maddox: Okay. Fuck you, Sean! This is bullshit. Okay guys. We've browbeat Sean enough here. Um, I wanna go back to the problems, Dick, that everybody apparently thought that gourmet dog food wasn't a problem.

Dick: It's not.

Maddox: Um, Dick. I have a new segment…

Dick: Oh, cool.

Maddox: Based on this comment that you said last episode. Let's hear this new segment.

(Drumroll, snappy bass line. "Dick…is full of shit…yeah." (Maddox and Sean laugh) "Hooo!! What a drag." (Dick cracks up)"What is truth, what is fiction? Dick…doesn't know…" (Dick: A little long, I think. (laughing)) "Dick…bulllshiiiiiiiiit.")

Dick: Did you mean to do that? Dick doesn't know dick?

Maddox: Yeah. Yeah.

Dick: Oh, okay. That's good.

Maddox: And you're full of shit.

Dick: How come all of my produced segments sound like they have other people and sound professional, and all of yours just are you.

Maddox: 'Cause I just make them, Dick! I don't pay other people to just make segments for me. I just fucking do them. Um, so that's a new segment. It's called "Dick's Full of Shit".

Dick: Right.

Maddox: And you remember, Dick. I don't know if you remember in the last episode, you said this about gourmet dog food and regular dog food. Here's what you said.

Dick: Okay.

(Clip: Maddox: "What do you mean, Dick? What do you mean, they're feeding them other pets?" Dick: "That's what dog…dog food is other dogs." "You can splurge and not have to know that you're feeding your dog other euthanized dogs." )

Maddox: Okay.

Dick: Yeah. That's true.

Maddox: No, that's not true.

Dick: It's absolutely true. (grins)

Maddox: It's absolutely fucking not true. 'Cause I have a study from the FDA. FDA actually did this study because a lot of people… a lot of people were believing this urban legend, like you, apparently.

Dick: Okay. (skeptical)

Maddox: So the FDA did this study. They said, "In order to determine if…" you were complaining that pentobarbital was found in pet food, right? Which is something that they use to euthanize pets in pet stores. And that's what you…that's how you concluded that they were feeding dogs other dogs.

Dick: Well, that logical progression is false, but yeah, I will agree with both of those things. There is euthanized dogs in dog food. There is road kill in dog food. And there is phenobarbital in dog food.

Maddox: Okay, well, you're wrong. (Dick laughs) They checked for phenobarbital. Uh, it's actually pentobarbital in pet food and they found that it's down to 2 parts per billion of pentobarbital in dry dog food.

Dick: So there is.

Maddox: That's less than what you find in our water supply. Our own human water supply.

Dick: There's also dead animals in our water supply. What do you mean…so it is there?

Maddox: 2 parts per billion, Dick! That's nonexistent! That's residue that you would find anywhere else! You could find…(stammers) that's like finding cyanide in apple seeds. Yeah, it exists, but it's a nonissue. It's nonexistent. And here's another…here's another thing about the ground-up dogs and cats…

Dick: Wait, are you done with that part? That study?

Maddox: No, no, hold on. Lemme get through this real quick.

Dick: Go ahead.

Maddox: Um, they said, "All samples from the most recent dog food survey that tested positive for pentobarbital as well as a subset of samples that tested negative, were examined for the presence of remains derived from dogs or cats."

Dick: Okay.

Maddox: "The results demonstrated a complete absence of material that would have been derived from euthanized dogs or cats."

Dick: In dry dog food?

Maddox: Yeah. Complete absence, Dick.

Dick: So it's not there. You know, man. It sure sounds like you got me.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: Doesn't it.

Maddox: It does.

Dick: (sighs) Looks like I'm a little out of my league here, doesn't it?

Maddox: Uh-huh.

Dick: Einhorn, good work.

Maddox: Yeah. (giggles)

Dick: Except for this ONE SMALL THING.

Maddox: Here we go. (laughs)

Dick: ONE little detail you might have failed to miss.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: Maddox, do you know what an appendix is?

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: I don't mean the one in your body.

Maddox: Okay, sure.

Dick: I mean like, in the case of a study.

Maddox: Yes, I am a published author.

Dick: Right. (Maddox giggles) At the bottom, they have a little thing called an appendix.

Maddox: Uh-huh.

Dick: An innocuous little word, right?

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: But sometimes, if you wanna be thorough with studies, you have to click on it.

Maddox: Okay.

Dick: You have to follow up with things.

Maddox: Sure.

Dick: And see how they made this study.

Maddox: Sure!

Dick: You know? What questions did they ask to find if people were more concerned about their own food or their pets' food?

Maddox: W….that's…that's…

Dick: When they research dog food, for example.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: Where did they get this food?

Maddox: They got it…

Dick: What…what kind of a sampling was made of food to get these results? It's interesting that you bring in that study.

Maddox: Yeah. Mhmm.

Dick: Because I happen to have the appendix.

Maddox: Uh-huh.

Dick: With me.

Maddox: Okay.

Dick: Let me read from the top.

Maddox: Let's hear it.

Dick: It's not often that you see an entire sentence in capital letters on a government website…

Maddox: Mhmm. (skeptical)

Dick: But this one happens to be.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: From the appendix of that study…

Maddox: Sure.

Dick: In all caps. "These results need to be understood within the following context. Sampling was nonrepresentative. Samples were purchased from retail outlets in the Laurel-Madison area only. Dry dog foods with certain animal-derived ingredients were sampled. This selection pattern meant that the samples were not representative of dog food nationally or even locally."

Maddox: Well, how is it possible that it's not representative of dog food locally if they took a sample from the local supply?

Dick: It says SPECIFICALLY…"This means this study is invalid to draw conclusions on dog food nationally or locally." (yelling)

Maddox: Dick, it's obviously not, because they derived conclusions from them and they published them in the FDA. They don't…the FDA is not in the business of publishing studies on non-data! They publish studies on the data, and I looked into it. They…they…

Dick: However, the FDA also says this about this study.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: "The concentration of pentobarbital, if present in any US pet food, may be different than the findings of these surveyed. These results apply only to the specific lots analyzed." Why would they say, "This study means nothing."?

Maddox: Because, Dick. They didn't say, "This study means nothing." Because they published it. If the study meant nothing, they wouldn't have published it. What they said, Dick, is that they're scientists. They're trying not to mislead people. They're trying to just explain that yes, this isn't a national sample. But what? Do you think that food, uh, dog food suppliers, like, vary wildly all across the country? Some of 'em do euthanized pets and some of 'em don't?

Dick: Yes.

Maddox: Here's the thing, Dick. No, Dick. Because here's where the majority of dog and cat food comes from. It's rendered animals. Like, that we eat.

Dick: Right.

Maddox: Cattle and chickens and pork. The pieces that we don't eat.

Dick: Mhmm.

Maddox: The stuff that they usually put in hot dogs…

Dick: It's mostly that.

Maddox: It's mostly that.

Dick: It's mostly the 50% of the cow that it's illegal to feed humans.

Maddox: Right.

Dick: That's what dog food is.

Maddox: It's not that it's illegal, because…

Dick: (interjects) It is. It is absolutely illegal to feed those parts to people!

Maddox: What parts?

Dick: Half of the cow! I don't fucking know! I'm not a farmer! (yells)

Maddox: You…if you own a cow, you can eat as much or as little of it as you want.

Dick: You can't sell it to people to eat, though, you dickhead! Of course you can eat it yourself!

Maddox: You can…what's…name one cattle part that you can't buy in a butcher store! (yells) Tell me one cattle part that they won't sell you!

Dick: You can't serve it to people and say, "This is meat."

Maddox: You can do whatever you want with it. You can take hooves and make a broth out of it, if you want!

Dick: No you ca….(screeches) And you have to say, "This was made out of hooves."

Maddox: Yeah!

Dick: You can't say it's a meat slurry!

Maddox: But it's not illegal! It's not fucking illegal, you're FULL OF SHIT! (yelling)

Dick: No. It is TOTALLY illegal, you shit head!!!! (yells)

Maddox: No, it's no, you fuck!! (yelling)

Dick: Yes, it is!!

Maddox: No it isn't!

Dick: It's illegal to take an entire cow, put it in a blender, and then say, "This is a hamburger."

Maddox: W…

Dick: (interjects) You have to take the meat off the cow to do that!

Maddox: You can explain what's in it and the consumer has the choice to buy it. You can't mislead them.

Dick: Illegal.

Maddox: No, it's not illegal. (laughing)

Dick: No way. No, it's not.

Maddox: According to what? Cite a law, dickhead! You're full of shit! (yells) I'm calling you on it!

Dick: I'm not gonna pretend to cite a law! You can look it up. There's a Slate article that has the whole thing of…um, of serving euthanized dogs as pet food.

Maddox: I read that article.

Dick: Good.

Maddox: And not a SINGLE source! (yells) Hey, Dick! Did you check the appendix for that article? No!! I'll answer that for you, because it doesn't exist. I read that exact same article, Dick!

Dick: Maddox, you can't get these people on anything! They don't have to say if it's for pet food, that it's euthanized pets. That's the point! It's not a law. They don't have to say anything.

Maddox: Dick…

Dick: (interjects) Where are the pets going, then? Of course they're going into the food!

Maddox: No, they're not!

Dick: Because they have TONS and TONS of dead pets!

Maddox: It's not.

Dick: What are they gonna do, just eat it as a loss?!? (yells)

Maddox: No.

Dick: No, they're gonna feed it to your fucking dogs!

Maddox: No. They incinerate a lot of them, Dick.

Dick: Why?!!?

Maddox: They don't put…

Dick: (interjects) Why would they do that when they can just sell it?

Maddox: Because they don't put dogs into dog food! That's an urban legend! And this study…if you were so busy reading the appendix, you missed this little detail, 'cause, "…the sensitivity of this method that they tested is 0.005% on a by-weight basis. That is, the method can detect a minimum of 5 pounds of rendered remains in 50 tons of finished feed!! Presently, it is assumed that the pentobarbital residues that are entering pet foods are from euthanized, rendered cattle or even horses." That's where it's coming from. Not from fucking dogs. You're full of shit, Dick. And I called you on it.

Dick: Alright. I made my point.

Maddox: You…(giggles)…you said things.

Dick: Yeah.

Maddox: I'm not sure you made a point. (laughs)

Dick: I made my point.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: Uh, the shit dog food is full of charcoal and ash at a minimum.

Maddox: You have no evidence!

Dick: I think…would you agree with that?

Maddox: No evidence!

Dick: Maddox, they're not putting it on the label! Because it's bad for business. There's no laws requiring them to put this shit on the label, so they don't!

Maddox: Well then, why would the FDA test this stuff, Dick?

Dick: B…I don't know! (yells) I don't know why they would do that!

Maddox: Food and dru…it's the Food and Drug Administration.

Dick: Why wouldn't they…(stammers) why would they test it at all?!

Maddox: Because of urban legend idiots like you. You guys are, like, worried about dog food being…

Dick: (interjects) The FDA goes around proving urban legends wrong?

Maddox: Hey, the government went out having to prove truthers wrong on 9/11!

Dick: Why didn't they DNA test the fucking Shroud of Turin, then? A lot of people think that's a religious relic.

Maddox: Because that doesn't affect public health. But the FDA, the government went out and tested truther claims about 9/11 because there was enough of them.

Dick: Yeah.

Maddox: And same thing here! They tested…they said, "Okay, let's placate these idiots. Let's get a bag of dog food and just test it." Full of shit!

Dick: Look, I…okay. That's full of shit. So, you think it's totally ridiculous that a corporation is gonna say, "Oh, it's illegal for me to process all these carcasses into food, but it's not illegal to ship them out of state and do it, and then ship 'em back in and I don't have to tell anyone I did it? Uh, yeah. I'm gonna do it." That's how they work.

Maddox: Yeah. Well, Dick. The entire study…if you had read the entire study…

Dick: (interjects) I read that entire study! The guy sent it to both of us!

Maddox: Yeah. And did you read the part where it says that they found even trace amounts of pentobarbital in dog food actually extended their lives? Did you read that part?

Dick: That has nothing to do with what we're talking about!

Maddox: YOUR case last time was that this shit was unhealthy and that…

Dick: (interjects) Of COURSE it's unhealthy!

Maddox: (interjects) Dick, there is…

Dick: (interjects) Lemme just…fine. Lemme just read you this email.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: (stammers) You're saying it's not unhealthy to eat garbage?

Maddox: Dick, obviously not, if they did a test and they found that the dogs are living longer. And Dick, by the way…

Dick: (interjects) That's asinine!

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: That feeding dogs garbage makes them live longer…

Maddox: (interjects) You know what's asinine?

Dick: Why don't you eat it then, Maddox? Start eating fucking dog food!

Maddox: We do.

Dick: You don't care about expensive steaks or cheap steaks, just start eating…

Maddox: I have! (laughing)

Dick: …handfuls of pedigree, you motherfucker!! (angry)

Maddox: Yeah. And guess what? It'll be full of dogs apparently, right, Dick?

Dick: Start eating Bachelor Chow.

Maddox: Dick, here's the thing…

Dick: (interjects) It's not full of dogs. It's not entirely dogs. They're just in there.

Maddox: Yeah. Fuckin' bullshit!

Dick: That's the level of quality you're getting in that food!

Maddox: Oh, man.

Dick: It's mostly shit from slaughterhouses that they can't feed humans, 'cause it's illegal!

Maddox: Yeah. Well, it's not dogs. It's not dogs and cats.

Dick: They're in there!

Maddox: No, they're not!

Dick: They're in there!! (yells)

Maddox: Dick. Dick, here's the problem with your argument, kay? You said that this sample is not representative…

Dick: Yeah.

Maddox: However, nonetheless, it is a sample of one. They did at least one test. You have ZERO tests where they have found dogs in dog food! That's zero versus one! I win.

Dick: How much did they find in there? (grins) None?

Maddox: None.

Dick: So they took…they took a little piece of kibble…a non-representative piece of kibble…

Maddox: It is representative.

Dick: …and what, they spliced it for fuckin' DNA?

Maddox: No! They're…

Dick: (interjects) After it was mulched?

Maddox: The sensitivity is 0.005%. So, less than 5 pounds for 50 tons of feed! There may be…5 pounds for 50 tons, that means there's zero pets in there.

Dick: 5 pounds for 50 tons?

Maddox: For 50 tons.

Dick: I don't know.

Maddox: (laughing) Yeah, you don't know, that's why this segment's called "Dick's Full of Shit"! (laughing)

Dick: Well, you didn't prove that.

Maddox: Dick. Let's get to the problems.

Dick: No, no, no. We're not…I've got voice mails, man.

Maddox: Alright. (giggles)

Dick: Here you go. Let's get off of this dog shit.

Maddox: Oh, my God.

(Voice mail: "Hey Dick, hey Maddox. This is Dave from Texas callin' in. Um, first off, I'd like to say that actually, yeah. Sean deleting the podcast IS THE biggest problem in the universe, 'cause if he keeps fucking up and deleting the podcast, how are we gonna know what the problems are? How are we ever gonna find out what is the biggest problem in the universe?" (Maddox: It's true) Well, aside from it being Sean deleting the podcast, that's it. (Maddox laughs) Secondly, Maddox, I'm amazed that you didn't mention that, you know, all these people buying gourmet dog food, all this horseshit, all it is, is stupid assholes buying a narrative. (Maddox: Yeah, I did say that.) People go on trying to always quote me. (Dick: You did? Maddox: Yes.) I had a roommate who would say, (Maddox: Check the transcripts.) Hey, you know, feeding a dog regular food, it's basically like ramen. These foods are all just filled with, you know, wheat and grains. Dogs don't need that." Have you ever looked at the ingredients on this shit? What do they put instead of wheat? Fucking potatoes. This goes right with your problem of French fries being a problem. So you're a stupid asshole for not figuring that out. (Maddox: Is he talking to me? (chuckles) Dick: I think he's talking to you.) Dumb shits saying that, "Oh, we don't want to feed our dogs wheat! So instead, they cram potatoes down their stupid mutt's throat. Fuck dogs! (Sean laughs) (Maddox chuckles) Well, alright, no. No, fuck those people. Dogs are okay. Um…also, Dick, go fuck yourself." )

Dick: Allllllright. Alright. I've had enough of that today.

Maddox: Yeah. Yeah.

Dick: Uh, let's see. Here's a guy that agrees with you.

(Voice mail: "Dick. Pets are not members of your family. (Maddox: Yep) Members of your family cannot have replacements purchased. (Maddox: Right) When your mother dies, you don't go out and buy a new old broad. (Maddox, Dick, and Sean laugh) Maddox, are you serious? Dick's complaining about people going to bed hungry and you're complaining about not being able to buy pizza after you snack on nuts? (Maddox cracks up) Not even close to the same thing, buddy. (Maddox and Dick laugh))

Dick: Uh, let's see here.

Maddox: Yeah, I was really hungry after that episode. (giggles) It was a big problem.

Dick: Yeah.

(Voice mail: "Hi, this is Pete from West Virginia. It was quite a while ago, but when Maddox brought in the problem of "Dogs", his reasoning was complete bullshit. (Maddox: Mmkay.) But you don't own a dog for companionship, or to love it…myeh myeh myeh…(silly voice) (Maddox laughs) You own a dog so that if somebody breaks into your house, they get their fucking throat torn out. ( Maddox: Yeah. Dick: It's true.) You idiot. (Maddox: Yeah, with all these poodles everyone owns) Love the show, guys. Keep doing what you're doing.")

Maddox: Corgis and poodles, and shitzus…

Dick: Alright. I've got…I do have a voice mail from a vet tech who says I'm right about them putting dogs in dog food, but I think we've talked about it enough.

Maddox: Yeah. I mean, that's fine, if you want to cite one vet tech versus the veterinary organization that the FDA polled for their testing methods. Sure.

Dick: So the fact that it says, "not representative" means nothing to you.

Maddox: Dick, it's not representative of a national study, because their scientists are not trying to mislead people. I'll…I'll cede you that point. However, they found zero pets in pet food. You have zero evidence. You have not a single study…a single inkling except for the shitty Slate article, which I read that cited zero studies. (Dick sighs) I looked everywhere for that, Dick. I wanted to know. Are they really grinding up dogs in dog food?

Dick: Yeah.

Maddox: Of course fucking not. It's cattle, pork, and chicken. It's just pieces that we wouldn't eat. That's what dogs eat.

Dick: It's pieces that it's illegal for us to eat.

Maddox: It's not illegal, Dick!

Dick: It totally is!

Maddox: (stammers) Cite one law. What's the law?

Dick: Maddox! I'm not a pretend Internet lawyer like you, alright? (Maddox giggles) (Sean laughs) I don't have these made-up laws in my head!

Maddox: And yet you're SURE of it!

Dick: I'm not SURE of it, I'm saying LA County ships out 200 tons of animal carcasses out of the state every month. Why? Why are they doing that? To light 'em on fire in the desert? Okay! Ship 'em out, then the same-looking truck brings back in a bunch of animal feed. Oh! I guess somebody figured it out.

Maddox: Dick, you know what they do with a lot of animals…animal carcasses…

Dick: What?

Maddox: Is they render them into coagulants. They render them into things that we use into…in asphalt, and plastics, and rubbers, and things like that. That could be another use for these animals, not grinding them up and feeding them to more pets.

Dick: (sighs) Oh, God. I'm sick of this.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: Alright, can we get to some problems?

Maddox: Let's get to the problems. What's your first problem this week?

Dick: My first problem is Christmas presents for guys.

Maddox: (guffaws) Okay, why is that a problem?

Dick: 'Cause it's a…buying Christmas presents for guys is a huge fuckin' problem.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: And it doesn't need to be.

Maddox: (stammers) What specifically is a problem with it?

Dick: It's impossible.

Maddox: Oh, it's difficult.

Dick: Yeah. It's…I got…I got the Christmas shopping for my mom and my sister done in about 10 minutes.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: No problem. 'Cause women don't care. You just get them something, they appreciate that you spent money on 'em, and it's done. Job's done.

Maddox: What are you, kidding? It's like, the exact opposite with me.

Dick: What do you mean?

Maddox: Women are the hardest to buy things for.

Dick: Why, what do you buy them?

Maddox: I don't know! I still haven't figured it out.

Dick: Just clothes.

Maddox: Every woman I've ever bought anything has hated it.

Dick: No, you…well, what are some things that you've bought women? (grins)

Sean: A lizard. (Maddox and Dick crack up)

Maddox: Perfume. I've bought DVDs…

Dick: Okay. Lemme tell you why that's bad.

Maddox: I know why it's bad. I've heard it! I got an earful!

Dick: What was it?

Maddox: "Uhh, it's not my scent. It's too strong! It's this and blablabla."

Dick: Yeah!

Maddox: Even if I…

Dick: It's very personal.

Maddox: Yeah, but I go to the perfume store with them and I see them pick something out, and they sniff it, and go, "Oh, this smells really good, mmm. Maybe I'll buy this some time." And they put it down on the shelf and I'll remember that.

Dick: Uh-huh.

Maddox: Right? And I'll go back there to buy the exact same perfume, and they'll NEVER fucking use it! (Dick giggles) A dress that they pick up and they look at and they're like, "Oh, it's too expensive." I'll go buy that dress! They won't ever wear it.

Dick: You've bought women a dress and they hated the dress!?

Maddox: The…yeah, a dress that they pre-selected! My ex-girlfriend, I bought her a fucking expensive-ass dress, gave it to her. That she pre-selected. She didn't have the money on hand and I went back when she wasn't around and bought her this dress, and she fucking never wore it once.

Dick: Well, that doesn't mean she hated it.

Maddox: Well…

Dick: Maybe you should start taking her to an expensive steakhouse and she'll put it on.

Maddox: Jesus.

Dick: Was she pissed off about it?

Maddox: Put the pounds on. Uh…(giggles) She wasn't pissed off about it, but she seemed, "Oh, okay, thanks." (girly voice)

Dick: No, 'cause that's…I'll tell you the secret of buying gifts for women, then.

Maddox: Yeah, what is it?

Dick: You buy them…well, this is what I always do. I buy them clothes from a place that I know they want to shop at. With 100% certainty that they're gonna take them back.

Maddox: Oookay.

Dick: So it's like just giving them cash.

Maddox: Gift cards.

Dick: And saying, "Go shopping", except that's tacky.

Maddox: Yeah. It just leaves me empty, man. So, you think it's harder to buy for guys than girls.

Dick: Well, at least women are very appreciative of what you bought them.

Maddox: Dick, I have had it completely…

Dick: You have had the opposite experience of this?!

Maddox: No. My mom is the worst. Every single gift I've ever given my mom, even cash, she's complained about the cash, that it was not enough. (Dick and Sean crack up) Yeah!

Dick: Well, how much was it? A dollar fifty?

Maddox: It was a hundred bucks! I'm like, "Here you go, mom! Here's a fucking envelope full of cash!" (Dick laughs) Take it and shove it up your ass! And she didn't appreciate it. It was not enough! Oh, just 100$?

Dick: (cracking up) Merry Christmas!!

Maddox: She's like "I gave birth to you and this is all I'm worth?!" I'm like, "Mom, it's a fuckin hundred dollars, what do you want, man?!" It's a hundred dollars! Just take it! (Dick cracks up) Shut up and take it! And I bought her, like, some expensive forks and knives. Hated it.

Dick: Okay, wait a minute. I'm keeping track of all these presents. (grinning) That's a shitty present. Forks and knives for mom.

Maddox: Yeah. What? It's silverware!

Dick: (guffaws) How old were you?!

Maddox: I was uh…like, 18 at the time? Yeah.

Dick: (laughing) Okay, what's next?

Sean: Next time, just buy her a vacuum.

Dick: (cracks up) Have you ever bought a woman a vacuum?!

Maddox: Mmmmmmm….

Dick: An appliance?

Maddox: No…yes, I have bought a woman an appliance.

Dick: What appliance?

Maddox: A toaster oven. (Dick cracks up) She…wanted it! She said she wanted a toaster!

Dick: Did you buy her a matching, uhh…dress and say, "This is the dishwasher?" (Maddox cracks up)

Maddox: No, dude. I bought her a toaster over, because she wanted a toaster, and I thought, "What's better than a toaster? A toaster over. You can heat up non-bread in them. Pop-Tarts. You can make mini-pizzas. They're fucking great." And she hated it.

Dick: Okay. Here's the move on that one, though.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: You gotta give it to both of you. You can give that as a present, but you have to say, "This is something I got for both of us. You can't say it's for her."

Maddox: Well, she was disappointed as shit, buddy.

Dick: Well, yeah! 'Cause you built up her expectations. (laughing)

Maddox: Well, she wanted a cat, and I gave her a box about the size of a cat. And it didn't have any holes in it, obviously it's not a fucking cat. (Dick laughing) Unless cats can hold their breaths for a really long time. It was a toaster. It was the big item that year. She wanted a toaster. (giggles)

Dick: That sucks.

Maddox: I bought…I bought another girl, a long time ago, as a present, and this was such fucking bullshit. It's still, again, my ex. Um, it was a trip to, I believe it was, like, New Orleans or something like that. You know, a pretty nice gift, right?

Dick: Well, again, for both of us.

Maddox: So?

Dick: Did you get her that in lieu of a present?

Maddox: That was the present.

Dick: So you got it instead of, like, a physical thing.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: Like, you just gave her a vacation, like the Price is Right.

Maddox: Is that not a present?

Dick: Yeah, you can't do that.

Maddox: Am I living in a different fucking weird universe where trips no longer count as presents?!

Dick: It's not a present. I wouldn't be surprised…I'm not surprised that you're getting that reaction.

Maddox: I wanna cut myself right now. I'm so mad. This is such bullshit! (Dick laughs) How is that not a present?!! That's the best present.

Dick: Because it's an experience, like…the present is something that you get right now. In the present. Not in the future.

Maddox: Oh, I'm sorry. I'm sorry my gift isn't something you can return to the store with a gift receipt! I'm sorry my gift to you is a life experience! Oh, please, accept my apology for changing your life for the better.

Dick: Ehh…I don't know if a trip with you is a change in your life for the better. (Maddox laughs) You could have easily fixed that by getting her, like, something to wear while you were there, though.

Maddox: I did. That was when I gave her the expensive dress, Dick.

Dick: That was where you gave it to her.

Maddox: Yep.

Dick: You gave it to her on the trip? Was it New Orleans?

Maddox: Yup. It was not New Orleans. It was another place, it was another country, but…

Dick: I thought you said, sorry.

Maddox: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Dick: Did you give it to her at home, or did you….

Maddox: No.

Dick: Did you give it to her right then, the dress? Or did you give it to her on the vacation?

Maddox: On the vacation, on Christmas day.

Dick: Yeah, that's…oh, wow.

Maddox: Yeah. And nothing. Nothing was my response.

Dick: Not even a thank you.

Maddox: Well, "Oh, thanks." Okay.

Dick: Huh.

Maddox: Great.

Dick: That's rough.

Maddox: Makes me so…I know! That's why I stopped buying people gifts. It's always fucking TRAGEDY with me. (Dick cracks up) Tragedy! I bought my mom a clock one time because her bathroom…I found this clock that perfectly matched her bathroom. The same color and everything. Which is really hard to match, 'cause her bathroom's this weird color of like, light green, whatever. So I bought her this clock and I gave it to her with a card, with this little- pop-up card of this dog, where you open it up, and it's like, "Number one mom is you!" and it points at her.

Dick: Oh, god. (scoffs)

Maddox: And she goes, "What is this, a dick?!"

Dick: A dog? Why would…(laughs)

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: You got your mom a Christmas card that featured a dog?!

Maddox: Paper dog, whatever.

Dick: (guffaws) I don't think that's, like, something a mom wants, though!

Maddox: My mom was offended by it! She said it was a phallic gesture.

Dick: Yeah!! (grinning) (laughs)

Maddox: And then she said, "What's the meaning of this clock? Are you trying…are you waiting until I die? Is that what this is? (Dick cracks up) Are you counting the minutes until I die?!" I'm like no…fucking no, mom! Of course not…I mean if I…no! Shut up! (Dick still laughing)

Sean: Are you sure you're Armenian and not Italian or Greek? (Maddox laughs)

Maddox: Yeah. It's been tragic. The earliest I can remember disappointing a woman with a gift is when I was eight years old. I went outside in my street and I noticed in the street, there was all this, like, gold powder. And I thought, "Wow, this is neat."

Dick: Oh, from the reflectors?

Maddox: Yeah, the reflectors!

Dick: When they paint the reflectors? Yeah, yeah. I remember that.

Maddox: I remember carefully scooping it up on a piece of paper and then putting it in a Coke bottle, and it was this Coke bottle full of, like, gold-colored powder, and that was really precious to me. And I remember, I think it was Mother's Day or her birthday came around, and I thought, "You know what? I'm gonna give my mom this gift of gold powder." That's all I have.

Dick: Glitter.

Maddox: Yeah. (giggles) Well, it's not glitter. It's gold powder. (Dick laughs) It looked really cool!

Dick: Okay.

Maddox: And so I thought, "This is my gift to my mom." And I gave it to her and she goes, "What is this, dirt?" And she poured it out and just threw the Coke bottle away. (Dick laughs) I'm an eight year old! What the fuck do I have to give?! I got her this thing that was precious to me and she threw it away.

Dick: Yeah, your dad's supposed to help you out at eight.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: Your dad's supposed to take you to the store and then, like, buy some…whatever, jewelry or something, and then give to the mom with...from you.

Maddox: Yeah, he doesn't give a shit. He just got her ice cream or something. I dunno, man. (Sean laughs)

Dick: Ice creams?! (scoffs) Uh…somehow I knew this would be a good problem. (Maddox giggles) Well, you just…you gotta get girls, like, throwaway gifts. Like, just clothes…like, no statements. You don't want to get 'em furniture.

Maddox: Mmm. (skeptical)

Dick: You don't want something permanent that fucks with their décor.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: You unders…you know what I mean?

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: Just something that they can wear once, maybe, and not think about.

Maddox: Yeah. Or never. They can wear never and not think about. And just stuff it in the closet. It's 140$ reminder of a destroyed relationship. How about that? Fucking gifts are the worst, man.

Dick: (laughing) Well, I just had gifts for guys here. (Maddox cracks up) We can change it to Christmas presents in general.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: I wouldn't mind that.

Maddox: Okay, Dick. (grins) So, what's harder than this nightmare scenario I've described?

Dick: Well, I guess I just have an easy time buying presents for women?

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: And they all love them. They're all appreciative.

Maddox: Maybe you just have better women in your life.

Dick: That's definitely true, without this Christmas present shit.

Maddox: 'Cause your mom and your sister are great.

Dick: Yeah.

Maddox: Some of your exes, maybe not. But, like, your mom and your…

Dick: (interjects) They all liked their presents, though.

Maddox: Then they're fuckin'…they got a leg up on my ex.

Dick: Yeah, but for my dad and my brother-in-law, I have no idea what to get them. It is…the clock's ticking. I got like…T-24 hours or something like that, now. And moreso than that, I don't think guys really care, you know? The utility of giving a guy a present is much, much lower than it is giving a woman in your life a present. To me.

Maddox: That is true for my dad. My dad has never cared about a gift, ever. If I gave my dad anything, he was so appreciative. If I gave him a mug. If I gave him a screwdriver. If I gave him a bandsaw blade. Anything. He would be happy with it. If I gave him a hammer, he would be happy with it. He didn't give a shit. He loved tools. I just got him some tools and that was the end of it. I'd go to the store, 50 bucks later, I'm home. Shopping's done. I don't even have to wrap it. He says, "Hey, what's that screwdriver doing on the table?" I say, "Happy Birthday, dad! Merry Christmas!"

Dick: Or whatever!

Maddox: Whatever!

Dick: Yeah.

Maddox: And he goes, "Okay, thanks!" That's it!

Dick: Yeah, that's perfect.

Maddox: Problem solved.

Dick: And I'd rather just not even do that. Like, even when I get asked, "What do you want for Christmas?", I'm like, "I honestly don't know."

Maddox: Guys are so easy! Video games. Always. Period. End of story. Done. (Dick giggles) Omaha stakes, video games, yeah, great. Blowjob? Awesome. Rum? A porno mag? Awesome. I'm happy.

Dick: Yeah.

Maddox: Okay.

Dick: Well, that's my problem.

Maddox: Good problem, Dick.

Dick: Do you want to just make it Christmas presents?

Maddox: Sure.

Dick: 'Cause your argument is a lot more passionate than mine. (grins)

Maddox: (chuckles) Yeah, sorry. I didn't mean to hijack that.

Dick: I didn't know I was opening a nuclear can of worms.

Maddox: Yeah. Speaking of opening a nuclear can of worms, my problem this week, Dick, is "Sony"!!

Dick: Oh, very good.

Maddox: Yeah. Very, uh…very timely, I guess. So, you know, everyone is expecting me to talk about the Sony hack, which I will. I'll get to it. But I want to talk about why Sony is a problem.

Dick: Oh, okay.

Maddox: 'Cause I've hated Sony for a long, long time. 'Kay…a long time ago…you remember…you remember Sony got hacked. This isn't the first time Sony's been hacked. Back in, I believe it was, like 2009, 2010. Um…

Dick: Yeah, and they looked stupid as hell in that attack.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: Like, they…all their passwords were plain text, and they had, like encryption keys all over the place…

Maddox: Right. So here…let me give you a little bit of background. Sony, when they released the Playstation 3, the first generation, the Playstation 3 had this feature that allowed you to install any operating system you wanted to, like a secondary operating system. It allowed you to run homebrew apps. Like, if you wanted to develop a game for the Sony Playstation, you could do that through installing another operating system. It was also backwards compatible with certain Playstation 2 games, etc, etc. Right?

Dick: Yeah.

Maddox: So that's the system I purchased when the Sony Playstation 3 first came out.

Dick: Okay.

Maddox: Then, partway through Sony's…the PS3's life, Sony decided to do an about-face and released a firmware update that took away all these features.

Dick: Yeah. All the features that you can make your own stupid games on your own system?

Maddox: Well, the features of being able to play a Playstation 2 game on my Playstation 3, which was a big selling point for me.

Dick: Okay, alright. Yeah, that's bad.

Maddox: Right? So I said, "No, fuck you." And it pissed everyone off, because you're taking away features that we paid for.

Dick: Sure.

Maddox: Go fuck yourself. You can't take away something I bought. And that's…that's effectively what they did. So, I have here an article from Daily Tech. It says, "The effort to jailbreak the PS3 was born out of Sony's decision to ditch Linux support with the release of the PS3 slim in August 2009. Sony has since locked fat PS3s out of the new installs of Linux as well via a system update." So there's this guy named GeoHot. He was a kickass hacker. I think he's the guy who wrote the original iPhone jailbreak.

Dick: Right.

Maddox: Or at least one of them. And he…so this article says, "GeoHot has offered to stop distributing the keys…" Okay, so he wrote this hack for the Sony Playstation 3 to be able to revert it back to what it was.

Dick: So you could play Playstation 2 games on it.

Maddox: Yeah. Or run Homebrew, or whatever you wanted to.

Dick: Okay.

Maddox: Which is a very small subset of Sony fans. These are…

Dick: Yeah! Yeah.

Maddox: You know, less than 1%.

Dick: Doesn't matter. That's how you sold the product, so…

Maddox: Right. That's how they sold the product. So Sony got pissed off at him and threatened to sue him, and GeoHot said, "Look, he's going to offer to stop distributing the keys if Sony provides a means to install Homebrew and third-party software on the Playstation 3. He has also offered to work as a consultant for Sony or other major console makers (Microsoft and Nintendo) in safeguarding their next generation consoles from jailbreaks." So…

Dick: Hell of a resume.

Maddox: That's a hell of a resume. And a very nice offer by this hacker, right?

Dick: Sure.

Maddox: Sony sued GeoHot.

Dick: (scoffs) Oh, great.

Maddox: That was their response. (Dick laughs) Yeah. That was their response. (Dick sighs) So GeoHot doubled down, 'cause he's just a fucking kid. He doesn't give a shit. He has nothing that Sony…Sony's not gonna sue this kid for anything! They're fucking bullies!

Dick: Yeah.

Maddox: So he made this rap song as a response to the Sony lawsuit. This is kinda funny. Listen to this.

(Rap song starts, "-Year-old, it's GeoHot. And for those that don't know, I'm getting' sued by Sony. We'll take this out of the courtroom and into the streets. I'm a beast, at the least, you'll face me in the northeast. Get my ire up, light my fire. I'll go harder than Eminem went at Mariah. Call me a liar; pound me in the ass with no lube, chafing; you're fucking with the dude who got the keys to your safe and…")

Dick: Is he a rapper, or did he just do that for fun?

Maddox: He just did that for fun, and it was a big "Fuck You" to Sony.

Dick: Yeah.

Maddox: 'Cause he said, "Go ahead, sue me idiots! What are you gonna sue me for, you morons? I'm a kid!"

Dick: Hey, I know all about writing songs as a "Fuck You".

Maddox: (laughs) You do, Dick. Uh, you and I both, actually. You're still getting yours. Um, so. The response to this Sony GeoHot lawsuit was that Anonymous attacked Sony and took down PSN for a month.

Dick: I remember that.

Maddox: About a month.

Dick: Yeah, it was funny.

Maddox: Guess how much it cost Sony? 171 million dollars!

Dick: Well, woops. (giggles)

Maddox: Take that, you fucking morons!! You idiots! You bullies! You dipshits! You guys are gonna take away features from us! You're gonna piss off a small group of hackers. And then they're gonna cost you 171 million dollars! Did they learn their lesson, Dick? Of course they didn't!

Dick: Did anyone get fired for that? CEOs or anything?

Maddox: I'm sure not. I'm sure they didn't.

Dick: Mmm.

Maddox: Sony, yeah. It's just a string of bad decisions.

Dick: Are you sure? 'Cause I think…

Maddox: I'm not sure. I would guess that they didn't. Because Sony…Sony is a company that their number one product is bad decisions. Their number two product is a Sony Playstation. So, um…do you remember this product called Bleem, Dick? You know what Bleem is?

Dick: Yeah, it was, like, an emulator for the Dreamcast.

Maddox: Correct. It was an emulator, not just for the Dreamcast, but also for PC.

Dick: Okay.

Maddox: It was an emulator that someone wrote that would allow you to play Sony Playstation games on Dreamcast and PC and so on.

Dick: Okay.

Maddox: So, the guy who wrote Bleem was taken to court by Sony and time and time again, this is from Wikipedia. It says, "Ultimately, Bleem won in court and a protective order was issued to protect David from Goliath. Sony lost on all counts, including Bleem's use of screenshots of the Playstation games on its packaging. The court noted that Bleem's use of copyrighted screenshots was considered fair use and should be allowed to continue," So, the courts decided in favor of this emulation company, because what they were doing, is they were creating a product that would not only emulate a Sony Playstation, but it made their games look better.

Dick: Oh, that sounds cool.

Maddox: Yeah! Really cool.

Dick: I would think they would be for that, cause I thought video game hardware was, like, a sunk cost. Like, you lose money on the hardware and then you make it back on the games.

Maddox: Right.

Dick: So if you can get somebody else to write the emulator, then you're still making money on games, right?

Maddox: Yeah. Well, no, that's true Dick. So this was back in 2001, from the Register. This is an article on the Register. It…they say that "Bleem won the support of the court, beating a temporary injunction against sales of its emulator and later defeating Sony's demand to ban the sale of the emulator permanently." So you know how Sony decided to attack them? How to get around the courts? Here's what Sony did. The emulation company claimed that the Japanese giant's US operation had initiated a dirty tricks policy, which, in part, involved attempting to have Bleem thrown out in their May 1999 E3 show." So Sony tried to get these guys thrown out of E3…

Dick: Uh-huh.

Maddox: And then Bleem accused Sony of threatening retailers with much reduced Playstation 2 hardware and software allocation if they stocked any of Bleem's offerings.

Dick: Right.

Maddox: So Sony went to retailers and they said, "Hey, you know what? We lost in court. We know that. But if you guys carry this product, you're not gonna carry our product."

Dick: Well, yeah. That's uh…that's what you do.

Maddox: Yeah. Yeah. (scoffs) Bullying.

Dick: Sure. (giggles)

Maddox: They got around the courts. Look. Justice won…

Dick: Uh-huh.

Maddox: But Sony won over justice.

Dick: Yeah, I guess I don't have such a big problem with that. Did that end up costing them money?

Maddox: Sony? No, of course not. They just buried this small business owner. This guy who's like, just trying to make a living making emulators.

Dick: They should have bought him out.

Maddox: Yeah, they should have bought him out.

Dick: That would have been nicer, I guess.

Maddox: That would have been the nice thing to do, Dick. You buy…this guy's a pain in your ass? You hire him, and you say, "Hey, we like your product. Why don't you work for us?"

Dick: Right.

Maddox: Instead, they try to sue and do dirty tricks, and get you thrown out of E3, doing it the dirty way. The illegal way. The back door way.

Dick: I don't think that's a good idea with the Internet the way it is.

Maddox: Why?

Dick: Where everybody knows everything?

Maddox: Yeah…

Dick: And people are…there's a lot of vigilantes out there that can cause your business significant harm.

Maddox: Right.

Dick: I don't think it's a good idea to do that. That's all I'm saying.

Maddox: To what? To hire your enemies?

Dick: No! To attack them! What they're doing.

Maddox: Oh, yeah. Yeah.

Dick: Litigiously.

Maddox: Well, they did. They're a very litigious company. Fast forward to today, when Sony got hacked.

Dick: Yes!!!

Maddox: Right?

Dick: Now we're talkin'!

Maddox: Now, let's talk. Let's talk about this. So, Sony got hacked and it has since come out that it's probably North Korea. Um, but you know what Sony started doing against file sharing companies? They started doing a denial of service attack against them.

Dick: To get all their emails…to stop their emails from being torrented?

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: Yeah…they gotta do that!

Maddox: That's illegal, Dick!

Dick: Yeaaa…(scoffs) Okay. (exhales)

Maddox: That's a fact! Unlike your horseshit argument about…(stammers) cow hooves being sold to humans.

Dick: Wait a minute, I actually know some e…pretend Internet lawyer stuff about this. (Maddox laughs) If you're preventing a bigger crime, you can get off committing a crime.

Maddox: Mmmm. (skeptical)

Dick: That's true! Yeah.

Maddox: Naah.

Dick: Yes you can. That's a real thing. I don't know what it's called, but if you did…if you perpetrated a crime while trying to stop a greater crime from being committed…you can get off with that.

Maddox: Well, it depends. If it's in the case of national security, yes. But if you're…say, for example, wire tapping your ex wife because you think that she's trying to extort money out of you? That's true, you might be able to prove that in court, but they also might be able to throw that out and say, "Well, you just violated federal wire tapping laws, so we're not going to count that as admissible evidence. Or, we're going to also prosecute you for wire tapping."

Dick: All I'm sayin' is…(stammers) They're protecting a lot of p…like, those emails getting out, as funny as they are, as much as I want to read them…

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: That's pretty damaging to a lot of people's lives. Like, people we know's social security numbers are in there.

Maddox: Yeah, I have friends…

Dick: And their whole direct deposit account.

Maddox: Right. We have friends who work for Sony. It's a really shitty thing. And what really pisses me off. Our guest that we had on the show early on, I think episode 7 or 8.

Dick: Uh-huh.

Maddox: Ryan Holiday. Wrote this excellent piece talking about how there's no grey area about publishing these emails. It's wrong to do that. Because this is just stolen property. And the same people who were attacking the Jennifer Lawrence nude leaks…

Dick: Mhmm.

Maddox: Are celebrating the Sony hacks.

Dick: Yeah. (giggles)

Maddox: One stolen data is more valuable than another just because it's nudity and we're giving so much power to this sexuality and nudity in this country.

Dick: Yeah. It's funny though.

Maddox: What?

Dick: All the Adam Sandler stuff. Like, all the Sony emails about Adam Sandler? (grinning)

Maddox: Yeah. Sure. But Dick, who doesn't have incriminating shit? Like, everybody has something that they wouldn't want released. If your email got hacked?

Dick: Oh, God, yeah!! Oh my God!! I would just jump right…I would steer my car directly into a fucking wall if my email…ugh. I'm not even gonna say it.

Maddox: Me too. Except it would be kids. Um…(laughs) you know, Aaron Sorkin. He wrote an article for the New York Times about the yellow journalism that's going on here.

Dick: Yeah.

Maddox: This is a really good quote. He says, "The co-editor in chief of Variety tells us that he decided that the leaks were, to use his word, 'newsworthy'. I'm dying to ask him what part of the studio's post-production notes on Cameron Crowe's new project is newsworthy. So newsworthy that it's worth carrying out the wishes of people who have said that they are going to murder families who have so far done everything they've threatened to do. Newsworthy. As the character Inigo Montoya said in The Princess Bride, 'I do not think it means what you think it means.' So much for ever getting a good review from Variety again, and so much for our national outrage over the National Security Agency reading our stuff. It turns out that some of us have no problem with it at all. We just vacated that argument."

Dick: I read that.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: What you're talking about.

Maddox: He makes a good point.

Dick: Yeah.

Maddox: So, as much as I hate Sony, the people who are publishing their hacked and stolen emails are supporting the terrorists, these dickhead hackers from North Korea, or whatever. They're supporting them.

Dick: The newspapers? The media is?

Maddox: Yeah. The yellow j…and they're calling it journalism. They're lauding it like they're doing some courageous thing. That they uncovered…they unearthed this information. They didn't do shit! This fell on their laps and it's stolen data. How are they allowed to profiteer from this?

Dick: I…are you asking?

Maddox: Yeah, I'm actually asking. Yeah.

Dick: Yeah. I have no idea. I dunno what the law is there. I'm not a…

Maddox: Well, you're just taking stolen content and profiteering from it. And these are…these journalists could do one iota of work and find out and verify whether or not these emails came from a reliable source. Right now, anyone can publish anything and say, "Hey, I just found it in a Sony hacked email." They're not doing any research. They're not doing their due diligence. They're not picking up the phone and calling the president of Sony and asking her if she really wrote these emails. And of course she's gonna deny it if they did.

Dick: Yeah.

Maddox: So, this isn't journalism. We're just profiteering. This is just theater.

Dick: Well, this isn't Sony, though, either.

Maddox: What?

Dick: This isn't Sony. This isn't Sony's fault. Is it? Do you think that hack…do you think they beefed up security after the first hacks? Like, do you think that they did anything after that to prevent this one?

Maddox: No. (scoffs) I don't think so.

Dick: No. I heard a guy…there was some rep from Sony on the Finance Channel this morning…

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: Who said that experts said this would have happened to 90% of companies.

Maddox: Yeah, probably.

Dick: It's like, well, isn't that a lot? Like, isn't there a lot left? You're in the top 10% of companies? The size of Sony? You're happy about being as good as 10% of everyone else out there? That's not very good.

Maddox: No, that's not good at all.

Dick: No.

Maddox: And it's true, actually. You know, the companies I've worked at in the past, some of the companies had atrocious security measures.

Dick: Yeah.

Maddox: You could just FTP and grab everything you wanted to. Passwords are very predictable. This is a big problem all across the board. But Sony, okay, they're the victims here. I actually have to defend Sony, which I hate to do, because I hate the company, but I have to defend them. They're victims by being hacked. And we're not allow….we don't have the right to know what's in those emails. Right?

Dick: Sure. Yeah.

Maddox: However, Sony, again, legendarily known for making bad decisions, decided to cowtow to the demands of these terrorists!

Dick: Well, yeah.

Maddox: Why?

Dick: Oh, you mean why did they pull the Interview?

Maddox: Why are you supporting this? You're agreeing with their decision.

Dick: You're…are you talking about the Interview? I dunno where you're going next, but you're talking about how they pulled the Interview, right?

Maddox: They pulled the Interview.

Dick: Yeah. Because, number one…uh, who…whatever poorly translated message that came out with the last round of hacks…

Maddox: Right.

Dick: Said, "We're gonna kill people in theaters if this movie's shown". Right?

Maddox: Right.

Dick: Remember that?

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: And then the next thing happened was all the theaters…the big theater chains said, "Yeah, well, we're not showing the movie then, because Christmas Day is a huge theater draw and people in the middle of the country think this is gonna…think that they're gonna get killed going to a movie, so we're not playing the Interview."

Maddox: Okay.

Dick: "Fuck you, Sony."

Maddox: Sure.

Dick: So Sony said, "Yeah, okay." I dunno what the saying is for it, but the fight's basically over. We're not showing it then. You just cut our legs out from under it. We're not gonna look like shitheads here endangering people's lives if all of our distributors already said they're not gonna do it. We're not gonna do it.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: That's…that's the logical progression of what happened, but more importantly than that, this is a company. It's not their job to stand up to terrorists!

Maddox: No, it's not their job, Dick. Their job is to what? Just worry about their bottom line? (skeptical)

Dick: Make movies and video games!!

Maddox: (skeptical) Yeah.

Dick: They don't have any resources to stand up to terrorism!!

Maddox: They're…they're still fucking red-blooded Americans, Dick. And like every fucking…

Dick: (interjects) Red-blooded Japanese, you mean?

Maddox: No! They're not. This is Sony…Sony Entertainment Pictures…SPE…er Sony Pictures Entertainment is an American company.

Dick: Yeah.

Maddox: (stammers) Regardless of whether or not the parent company's Japanese. These are still Americans. Who are fucking cowtowing to terrorists and hurting our country.

Dick: You sound like Obama. He came out and said he was disappointed in them for what they did.

Maddox: Yeah, Dick.

Dick: That's fuckin' stupid!

Maddox: No, it's not. Because here's the thing. When I first heard about this hack, and I thought, "Okay, well, Sony's pulling the picture." I thought, "Well, maybe Sony has some inside information that we don't. Maybe they have been contacted by the State Department and the State Department said, "Hey, these threats are credible. Let's not…let's not push it here." And Sony, if they had released the movie, and if there were a terrorist attack, they would have looked like greedy assholes, right? So I thought maybe Sony was working out of self-interest here and they have every right to do so. However, when Obama came out and criticized them, and I have the quote here, it says, "President Barack Obama, in an end-of-year press speech, commented on the Sony hacking and stated that he felt Sony made a mistake in pulling the film. He expressed that producers should not get into a pattern where you're intimidated by these acts." And I couldn't agree more.

Dick: Noo. That's…(stammers) Well, first of all…

Maddox: Why? (snaps)

Dick: First of all, I'm annoyed that Obama said that.

Maddox: Why? As the leader of the United States, you're annoyed that he…

Dick: (interjects) Yeah. As the leader of the United States, it's your job to PROTECT us and our businesses from terrorist attacks!

Maddox: Right.

Dick: It's…it's…now you're telling me how I'm recovering from a terrorist attack? Fuck you!!! Do your job and protect us! You don't tell…don't moralize to me about how I'm protecting my employees!!

Maddox: Dick, you want Obama to go in and change their passwords for them? How would you like him to protect Sony from hackers? How would you like him to do that? Just explain that to me.

Dick: Uh…how politics works with…I dunno…(stammers) Well, I guess that depends on whether or not you think this is an act of war.

Maddox: Uh, potentially, but here's the thing, Dick. When you were saying that Sony pulled these…you know, distributors didn't want to carry the movie, therefore Sony just cancelled it.

Dick: Yeah.

Maddox: That's not true. Not all distributors did. In fact, in Texas…

Dick: (interjects) Not all of them, of course, but a shitload of them!

Maddox: (interjects) Well, that doesn't mean…

Dick: (interjects) Enough to make it no longer viable as a market…as a money making opportunity.

Maddox: (interjects) Well, it is…

Dick: (interjects) Enough to make a big enough deal so that they would pull it and not look like assholes!

Maddox: Dick, they're cowards. Because the Alamo Drafthouse…

Dick: (interjects) (scoffs) Cowards.

Maddox: The Alamo Drafthouse in Texas wanted to air this film, and Sony wouldn't even distribute it to them! These are people who are saying, "Bring it on! We're not afraid of these fucking terrorist attacks! These terrorist threats. We're gonna air it in SPITE of them." And then….

Dick: (interjects) I love it.

Maddox: Sony wouldn't send it to them.

Dick: So, a guy that burns the Qur'an, which is an expression…his form of expression.

Maddox: Sure.

Dick: Everybody called him a fucking idiot.

Maddox: He is.

Dick: Obama called him a fuckin' idiot, 'cause he was tempting fate.

Maddox: Right.

Dick: However, Sony PULLS a movie because there's terrorist attacks, and now Obama calls them a coward and everybody calls them a coward. What's the fuckin' difference? (angry)

Maddox: The difference is, Dick, that these are actual threats that are coming in from someone else. The guy who is burning the Qur'an is just trying to incite something. He's just being a dickhead. Look, if you…if we're being attacked by Islam and they're coming to us and saying, "Hey, we want to do XYZ and we're gonna commit all these terrorist attacks on this and this date." And then we cowtow, and say, well, we'd better not burn Qur'ans, then you're a coward. But if you're trying to incite something, that's totally different. This is a threat that's coming from North Korea, and Sony said, "Okay, please don't attack us! Here, what else do you want us to do?" Where does it end, Dick? Sony…if Sony cowtows to North Korea…

Dick: (interjects) It ends there.

Maddox: They cowtowed to North Korea here, and what's stopping anyone else from saying, "Hey, we're gonna make this terrorist attack. We're gonna make that terrorist attack." Where does it end? Do you just change your entire fucking life because of terrorist attacks?

Dick: I mean, I think it's easy for you to say and moralize here against Sony that they should, like, man up and stand up to terrorism, but for that to be, like a reasonable thing…for that to be pragmatic in the real world where they're just completely vulnerable to it, is fucking retarded. To expect Sony to "nut up" and stand up to terrorists when they don't have a) an Army to back it up with.

Maddox: Except the US Army.

Dick: They don't! Where the fuck is the US Army, then?

Maddox: We're protecting them just by virtue of the fact that they're in America, they're protected by the US Army!!

Dick: Really!?

Maddox: Yes.

Dick: Except they can't protect us from cyber vandals who destroy our ability to make money! Where's the protection there?!

Maddox: No, Dick.

Dick: No, if they were shipping cargo around the world…

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: And a North Korean sub sunk one of them…what's the difference!? (yelling) Do you think there's any difference between them hacking a database and ruining…destroying a film, a multi-multi-million dollar film, versus physically attacking a cargo ship and sinking it?

Maddox: Yes, absolutely.

Dick: What's the difference? They're both a massive loss of money and a direct hit to a company, like, to an American organization!!! What's the difference?!

Maddox: Right. Because bullets can't stop code, Dick. You can't shoot hackers. Hackers intruding your network. It's just entirely in some Cloud somewhere. You can't stop that with bullets and missiles. But you can with cargo ships that are sunk by submarines.

Dick: Eh.

Maddox: That's the difference. But if Sony's actually worried about repercussions, physical repercussions, why are they…why aren't they allowing people who want to air it, myself included, I'll fucking screen the film. I'll have a big…I'll rent a theater in Los Angeles. I'll fill up that theater full of people. I'll show a screening of the Interview. I don't give a shit.

Dick: Yeah?

Maddox: Go ahead, bomb me. Yeah.

Dick: And if they say they're gonna hurt some people if you do that, you're still gonna do it?

Maddox: Of course.

Dick: Well, that's on you, man. (scoffs)

Maddox: 'Cause as soon as you give in to their threats, Dick, then you always have to give in to their threats.

Dick: Wh…what do you…what does that mean? These terr…these anti-terrorist slogans just sound pretty, but they don't mean anything!

Maddox: It means you stick your ground and you stand up for your convictions! That's what it means.

Dick: Haaaa. (sighs)

Maddox: You might have to die for it sometimes! You don't be a pussy!

Dick: You might have to die for it!?! (yelling)

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: That's what you're thinking when you're going to work!? (yells) You're going to Sony, you're building a company that's a media company, and you're thinking about dying for your principles!? Where the fuck does that fit into this America?!

Maddox: Because people died for your ability to go to work safely, Dick.

Dick: No!

Maddox: Those people died in the past.

Dick: That's not true. They died to keep…they got…they died to protect your right to be separate from the government. To be liberated under the government…

Maddox: Mmmkay. (skeptical)

Dick: And not to be tyrannized by the government. That's what they died for!

Maddox: Yeah. (grins) Libertarian argument here. Here we go. (laughs)

Dick: It's the first thing in the fucking Constitution! The right to pursue…the right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness! Is Sony allowed to do this, now? No!!!

Maddox: (interjects) So…so…

Dick: There's no one protecting them!

Maddox: So, Sony was denied their right and liberty to the pursuit of their happiness.

Dick: Yeah.

Maddox: And you're okay with it.

Dick: Of course I'm not okay with it.

Maddox: Well then, what's the response, Dick? You think Sony did the right thing.

Dick: Yeah. They did…it's not…first of all, it's not appropriate for me to say whether or not they did the right thing. They did the thing that they thought would be best for their shareholders.

Maddox: Maybe…

Dick: That's all there is to it.

Maddox: Well…that's…

Dick: (interjects) It's not a private company's responsibility to stand up to terrorists.

Maddox: It's all our responsibility, Dick.

Dick: Oh, God!!! That's so jingoist. That's such horseshit!!

Maddox: Says the Bush lover here!! (grins)

Dick: And then, what do they get for it? They're getting attacked! And what happens? Obama comes out and shits on 'em more!

Maddox: He should.

Dick: What the hell does…he…why?!

Maddox: Because next time this happens, Dick…

Dick: (interjects) What's he doing?!

Maddox: If this happens to Kohl's, or Home Depot, or someone…someone comes across and says, "Hey man, we don't like this product that you're selling." What if it's Greenpeace, Dick, and they come to Home Depot and they say, "Hey, you guys are chopping down too much lumber. We're gonna blow up one of your stores if you keep doing it." And then Home Depot…what's Home Depot supposed to do, just like, close up their doors and fold up shop and say, "Hey, I guess we have a terrorist attack. We'd better close up!" We should always give in to terrorist demands? Is that what we do? Is that we are as Americans!? (excited) Is that what we are as free people?!

Dick: They're not…it's not as black and white as giving in to terrorist demands.

Maddox: Well that's what this is, Dick. They just gave right in, like a bunch of pussies.

Dick: They got…they gave in when they got hacked. They were already attacked. It's over.

Maddox: Yeah. Yeah. (skeptical)

Dick: There's nothing more to give in.

Maddox: Well, they did. No, it wasn't over, 'cause apparently…

Dick: The product was ruined! It was destroyed.

Maddox: It's not destroyed if people still want to watch it, Dick.

Dick: But there's nowhere for them to watch it.

Maddox: Of course there is.

Dick: 'Cause all the theaters shut down!

Maddox: I'll rent a theater. I'll fill it up.

Dick: Oh yeah. Sony's gonna make 55 million bucks back based on your theater in the middle of LA during Christmas.

Maddox: (interjects) I don't give a fuck…

Dick: There's not enough people in LA during Christmas.

Maddox: (stammers) I don't give a shit what Sony makes back. This isn't about Sony anymore. It's about principle.

Dick: Ugh. Then you've lost me entirely.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: Making principled decisions as a company…(Maddox cracks up) is fucking stupid.

Maddox: Okay. Alright, Dick. What's your…that's my problem.

Dick: No, no, no, no!!!

Maddox: We'll leave it up to the voting here!

Dick: Well…if we're leaving it up to voting, then I will say this.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: Sony brought us the Walkman.

Maddox: (scoffs) Yes.

Dick: That's a…that was pretty good.

Maddox: (laughs) Okay, so you're defending Sony 'cause we have the Walkman!

Dick: Well, I don't see what…so they're litigious.

Maddox: They're very litigious.

Dick: That's your entire problem with them?

Maddox: They're very litigious.

Dick: And they don't stand up to terrorists?!

Maddox: They're bullies, they are litigious. And they're cowards. That's what Sony is. They have…they have a track record of bad decisions. If they had simply just placated some of these hackers in the first place, the ones that they screwed over with their bad decision when they originally got attacked…

Dick: Uh-huh.

Maddox: When PSN went down.

Dick: Yeah.

Maddox: They wouldn't have lost 171 million dollars and inconvenienced millions of their own customers! But they're…this is a company that has a track record of bad decisions, and it's not ending here! They're still making bad decisions! They're executives that make bad decisions!

Dick: So they should placate criminals as long as it agrees with your ideology, you're saying.

Maddox: No, they didn't…those criminals didn't exist until they created them. Sony, as a backlash to Sony's theft of our property, we bought something that they took away from us. That's theft, Dick.

Dick: Yeah.

Maddox: So we responded…hey, weren't you just defending that you can return in kind if someone's breaking the law then you're allowed to break the law?!

Dick: No, I'm saying I thought I knew a law where if they're committing a greater…I was trying to say if someone is doing something that's VERY illegal, you're allowed to do something slightly illegal to stop them. That's not my belief, that's part of the legal system!

Maddox: Uhh…maybe. I don't know about that. But, uh…

Dick: Just a point of fact. That's the only reason I brought it up.

Maddox: Okay. So, anyway. These hackers were responding to Sony's theft.

Dick: Yeah.

Maddox: By simply trying to release this DMC key, and by the way, they didn't attack Sony until after Sony tried to sue GeoHot.

Dick: Yeah.

Maddox: That's when they doubled down, they said, "No, fuck you, Sony." And now these cowards are cowtowing to terrorists.

Dick: Yeah, I just…

Maddox: (interjects) They're making us weaker.

Dick: I really take issue with that. With how they're being portrayed by the government. And by you. (grinning)

Maddox: (laughs) Which one do you take issue with more? Me or the government?

Dick: No, the government. I don't really care. 'Cause I know you hate Sony. You're probably thrilled that they made this decision so you can hate on them more.

Maddox: Dick, I would love nothing more than for Sony to just go the fuck away, and start being a normal company just…give us a product that we want. Stop fucking us over every chance you get.

Dick: Yeah. (grins)

Maddox: And you know what? If somebody…

Dick: Do you have a PS4?

Maddox: Do I have a PS4?

Dick: Yeah.

Maddox: No, but I'll probably get one. (laughs)

Dick: (cracks up) Alright.

Maddox: It's the lesser of two evils right now and I love video games more than I hate Sony, so I have no choice.

Dick: Buddy, we're at an hour right now. I don't know if we have time for this one, but my next problem isn't gonna make any sense after this week anyway.

Maddox: Let's hear it.

Dick: Do you have time…do you have another problem too?

Maddox: I do.

Dick: Should we do a lightning round?

Maddox: You know what? Let's do a lightning round. Let's try to wrap this in another 20. We can do this. In 10 each. Let's do it.

Dick: Okay. My next problem is "The Whole Virgin Birth Thing".

Maddox: (scoffs) Okay. (Sean laughs) Okay, Dick. (giggles) What exactly…what does that mean?

Dick: You know, Jesus.

Maddox: Yeah, I know Jesus. (grins)

Dick: Jesus was, like, born from a virgin.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: Can we…can we drop that part?

Maddox: Why…Dick…it's part of a religion. Why?

Dick: Yeah, but a lot of stuff was part of this religion that's getting tossed, you know? Like the whole Noah's Ark thing? That's not…that's not a real part of it, is it?

Maddox: There are people who believe that. They believe that Noah's Ark crashed on this mountain in Armenia, actually, called Mount Ararat….

Dick: Ughhhhhh…(sighs) Come on with that!! (yells)

Maddox: That's what they say, man! Look, it's their beliefs. What's…(giggles) What's your problem?

Dick: Look, I think we got a…(laughs)…because…hold on, let me think of my problem with it.

Maddox: (cracks up) Okay. Great.

Dick: Look. Look.

Maddox: What do you have written down on that? You just have, like scribbles! (Dick cracks up) You just have, like, doodles of a guy with a beard! What is that? Are you drawing Jesus over there? Is that your…

Dick: No, no, no, no, no. Look. Look. I like…I don't have…my beefs with Christianity aren't so big. Okay? I don't have that many beefs with Christianity.

Maddox: Okay. (exasperated)

Dick: And I think we got a pope now who's letting a lot of things past the goalie, right?

Maddox: Cool pope. (laughs)

Dick: Like, he came out and said, "Hey, being gay ain't that bad."

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: Right?

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: And that blows some people completely out of it, but while he's saying it, they're like, "Oh, okay. I guess so. I guess I'm…I guess I'm kinda being an asshole." 'Cause he said, like, Jesus wouldn't judge gay people, or something like that.

Maddox: He said that, yeah. And he said something along the lines of, "We shouldn't worry so much about condom use and gays and abortion" and all these things.

Dick: Yeah. Yeah!

Maddox: He said what we should worry about are the things that Jesus taught us, which is compassion for the poor and taking care of people who are sick, and that sort of thing.

Dick: Right.

Maddox: Which is the prophecy…the philosophy of Jesus Christ. However, uh, it's been corrupted by this weird, deep Southern Baptist, like, I dunno what the sect of religion..

Dick: Yeah…I don't know…I don't about it. I just…I like it. I want it to keep going. Like, if we're gonna put religions up as teams…

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: Then I think to be viable for, like, the 21st century moving forward, we gotta just drop all the…all the magic stuff.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: Like the virgin birth thing. Noah's Ark stuff.

Maddox: Dick…

Dick: Right?

Maddox: No. (stammers) It's part…it's fundamental to the religion. I have here…I looked this…I forget the source's website. But they said "Denying a physical connection between Mary and Jesus would imply that Jesus was not truly human." Right? So Jesus was not born in sin. That's a fundamental tenet of Catholicism. (Dick guffaws)

Dick: Yeah, but do you think people going to church today aren't thinking anything about that? Come on!

Maddox: I mean, I don't know man, when's the last time you went to church?

Dick: No! They don't give a shit about that!

Maddox: Yeah, well. So they say here that he had no sin nature. It would seem that sin nature is passed down from generation to generation through the father, and the virgin birth circumvented the transmission of the sin nature and allowed the eternal God to become a perfect man. So that's what…that's Christian doctrine. Essentially. They're saying that Jesus was a perfect man who had no sin. That's why it's special. It's important to them. Why do you want to get rid of that, Dick?

Dick: What do you mean, them?

Maddox: Christians.

Dick: Ahhh…(scoffs) I'm not gonna speak for all Christians.

Maddox: Okay.

Dick: I'm just sayin' I think it's a little outdated.

Maddox: (scoffs) A little outdated.

Dick: Yeah! Come on, let's spice it up! We're letting gays in now!

Maddox: Alright.

Dick: They should come out, "Look, we got so many gay guys in here it's a fucking gay club in church. Come on out. Send everybody out."

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: Noah's Ark. I don't know. We don't even talk about it anymore. That stuff's weird.

Maddox: How…can you explain how exactly it's a problem though, Dick?

Dick: They're saying dogs are going to heaven now, did you read that?

Maddox: Oh, really?

Dick: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Maddox: To the big combine in the sky where they mulch 'em up into dog food, huh? (laughing)

Dick: Yeah. They do.

Maddox: Yeah. Lot of…about two tons' worth of dogs go to heaven.

Dick: How is it…it's a problem because I would prefer the message to be…

Maddox: (chuckles) Here we go.

Dick: I would prefer it to be, "Hey guys, we're all happy that you're here, but if you hear stuff like this, if you hear magicky stuff like this, it's didn't…it's not true."

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: It's just…just be on the lookout, 'cause you're gonna…people are gonna try to sell you stuff based on magic.

Maddox: Well, sure, Dick. But the fundamental difference between science and religion.

Dick: Uh-huh.

Maddox: Is that religion can't be proven. It's…it is faith-based. You have to BELIEVE in something, and if it's magic, if it's supernatural, if it's that Jesus had powers to walk on water and heal the sick by touch? That's the part of the religion that is incompatible with science. There is no proof.

Dick: What are you talking about, though? Do we need that stuff too? Get rid of all that stuff, too.

Maddox: Well, I mean…you know. Different religions have different degrees of that magic mysticism, right?

Dick: Yeah.

Maddox: So, what's…(giggles) What's your problem with it? I mean, as long as people aren't using that to kill people, sure.

Dick: Well, I tried…yeah. I tried to look up, like, how fast the religions were growing…

Maddox: Right.

Dick: And which one was beating which one?

Maddox: Oh, I think Islam's number one, right?

Dick: Yeah.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: Yeah.

Maddox: By how much, do you know?

Dick: No. 'Cause they all said they were the fastest growing.

Maddox: (laughs) Of course, yeah.

Dick: And it's like "What's the fastest growing religion?" The Google search was like, oh Scientology. Oh, Islam. Oh, Christianity.

Maddox: Mormons.

Dick: Yeah, Mormons. Right on top.

Maddox: For years. I remember growing up my whole life. Mormons were the fastest growing religion in the world. But…(stammers) They're not.

Dick: They're not.

Maddox: No.

Dick: No.

Maddox: Yeah, so. Um, okay. Okay, Dick.

Dick: Look, there's a lot of Christians. All I'm saying is let's…(stammers) Can we just drop that part of it?

Maddox: How would it help anyone to drop that part of it, Dick?

Dick: I dunno. It'd make everyone chill out a little more.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: I think!

Maddox: Maybe we should…

Dick: (interjects) Don't you think? You get that feeling?

Maddox: Yeah. You know what? Let's maybe just make Christmas lights grey. Why don't we just make Christmas lights grey? (laughs)

Dick: Well…tha…

Maddox: (interjects) Get rid of Santa. You have a problem with people believing Jesus was born from a virgin, but you don't have any problem with Santa Claus?

Dick: I don't think that many people actually believe in Santa Claus!!

Maddox: Oh, yeah, I got…

Dick: That's a big difference!

Maddox: Yeah. You're not in touch with the spirit of Christmas, buddy!

Dick: What's your next problem? (Maddox laughs) What's your last problem?

Maddox: My last problem, Dick. This is a big one, actually. This may be the biggest problem in the universe. (Dick giggles) "Ugly Sweater Parties".

Dick: You get invited to a lot of those?

Maddox: Ugly Christmas Sweater Parties. Yeah, man. All the time. Which, by the way, I gotta thank Randy Kien, a big long-time fan, for the suggestion of this problem. Uh, and we actually owe a debt of gratitude to him.

Dick: Uh, yeah. Randy's in the studio today. He's a quiet guy, so he doesn't have a mic. But he's actually…he played a major role in getting this podcast started.

Maddox: Uh, yeah. When we recorded the original six episodes, we kinda shelved them and didn't do anything with them, and then Randy kept bugging me to send him some of the old episodes. And he loved them, so he got the fire under our ass to start this up again, so thank you, Randy.

Dick: Yeah. Randy, is this episode everything you thought it would be when you were bugging us to do this? Talking about Sony and virgin births and uhh…what was my other one?

Maddox: You…uhh…that's…no. You had, births…

Dick: And getting…I guess Christmas presents in general was the problem now.

Maddox: Yeah.

Randy: This is the best Christmas present ever. (Dick and Maddox crack up)

Maddox: And yeah, uh…this would be better than if we heeled somebody in crutches. Listen to this, Dick. (Dick chuckles)

Dick: Do we need that?

Maddox: Ugly…wait, yeah, well. I gotta slip it in. Ugly Christmas Sweater Parties. Now, there's no such thing as a Christmas sweater. Have you noticed that? They no longer exist. Those may have existed in the past, before the 90's, when people were still sincere and wore things like sweaters around Christmas for some purpose other than to be a condescending hipster douchebag! (Dick giggles) The last time someone wore a Christmas sweater without it being an inside joke was the first Bush administration! Who exactly are you making fun of with your ugly Christmas sweater parties, huh, dickhead? Midwestern housewives? Good job! Way to make a statement against your grandma with your shitty Christmas party. The ugly sweater party has become a parody of itself. Right? They're no longer a self-contained unit. It's become a parody. It's a pissing contest to find the most lame sweater you can get. These sweaters used to be cheap, because nobody wanted them. Right? That's why they were ugly sweaters. Now they're expensive because EVERYONE wants them! They want the ugliest sweater they can find. The uglier it is, the more expensive it is!

Dick: That's not true, though.

Maddox: No, it's tr…it's absolutely true!

Dick: No, you can get shitty sweaters at Wal-Mart for, like 3 bucks a pop.

Maddox: Dick -

Dick: My whole family did our Christmas portrait with ugly sweaters.

Maddox: Yeah, but everything's cheap at Wal-Mart. But if you try to find…

Dick: Okay! (scoffs) So you can or can't find them there? You definitely can.

Maddox: No, but you're not gonna fi…the uglier they are, the more expensive they are. The ones that they sell at Wal-Mart are mass-produced.

Dick: Oh, I see.

Maddox: Yeah. They're…

Dick: (interjects) So you want, like…you're talking about, like a custom-made, quality ugly sweater.

Maddox: Exactly.

Dick: Custom…yeah, okay.

Maddox: Which, by the way, Dick. If you go to Amazon right now and literally just type in "Christmas Sweaters", you will find nothing but ugly Christmas sweaters. And they're called "Ugly Christmas Sweaters". Because that's all they manufacture anymore. Are these a thing anymore? Do they…

Dick: Well, it's a style.

Maddox: Well, yeah, it used to be.

Dick: I don't think it's as…I don't think it's as aggressive as you're making it. Like, they're not shitting on their grandmas' sweaters, they're just kinda like cutting loose.

Maddox: No, it…no. Everybody's standing around with their red cello cup swishing around their fucking Jack Daniels. And they're looking at each other in the eyes with a wink and a nod, saying, "Hey, look how ironic and funny we're being. Aren't we so hilarious and cute, making fun of the mid-West?" (goofy voice) No, fuckhead! Nobody wears these sweaters anymore! Maybe your grandma did!

Dick: Oh, my….(screeches)

Maddox: You're makin' fun of your grandma!

Dick: I don't know if they're thinking that. These people aren't, like, these 80's bad guys from like a shitty skating movie…(Maddox laughs), like, "Oh, out here we rollerblade. We don't use skates!" They're just, like…it's fun to wear something ugly every once in a while.

Maddox: Why specifically ugly Christmas sweaters, Dick?

Dick: 'Cause you don't have to worry about what you look like. It's a big relief for some people, I think. And it's something they're doing together. It's fun to do together.

Maddox: No, no. You didn't listen to the question. Why specifically ugly Christmas sweaters? 'Cause you could do that anytime. "Hey guys, we're having an Ugly Clothes Party! Just wear something ugly." That's different than ugly Christmas sweater. Ugly Christmas sweater is something very specific…

Dick: Yeah.

Maddox: That comes from a very specific part of America. The mid-West.

Dick: Well, I don't know if that's true.

Maddox: Well, of course it's true. The people in San Diego aren't wearing Christmas sweaters, 'cause it's fucking hot! They specifically wear ugly Christmas sweaters as a parody of something that people used to do in the mid-West. Nobody wears these anymore. Nobody makes them anymore.

Dick: You mean…you don't mean the mid-West specifically…like, northern states and northern countries where it's cold.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: Not specifically the mid-West.

Maddox: Correct, yeah. The northern…

Dick: (interjects) Yeah, but everything looked ugly in the 80s and 90s. Like, all styles look ugly when you look back at them.

Maddox: Well, no, I wouldn't say that it's necessarily ugly, it's just anachronistic. It's no longer relevant.

Dick: Yeah. And they all looked weird, because Christmas sweaters are so specific, it's usually something that was made for you or purchased for you.

Maddox: Right, but they weren't so over the top ugly. They were maybe just a reindeer pattern or a snowman pattern. They were kinda goofy and fun. Now they're being obnoxiously ugly. Intentionally ugly.

Dick: Oh! So what?! (yells) It's fun! (grins)

Maddox: Great. Everything's fun, Dick. (Dick giggles) Get a dog! Feed it gourmet dog food! It's fun!! Why not? Fuck it, it's fun. Fucking cowtow to terrorists! It's fun! You know, on Amazon they sell an Ugly Christmas Sweater kit, Men's Make-Your-Own Ugly Christmas Sweater. And then Urban Outfitters, Hot Topic…if you just search for Christmas sweater, all you can find are ugly Christmas sweaters. And they call them ugly by name. You can't buy a non-ugly Christmas sweater!

Dick: Yeah. What the fuck is the problem?

Maddox: Why can't…Dick, if you wanted to go out and buy a Christmas sweater. Say you're a sincere person. I know this is really hard for you. It's a stretch for you to be sincere.

Dick: Okay.

Maddox: But imagine putting yourself in the mindset of someone who is sincere who just wants to buy a Christmas sweater.

Dick: Right.

Maddox: You go to the store and you want to buy a Christmas sweater. Oh, lo and behold, there's all this tacky bullshit with reindeer and flashing lights and god-awful color schemes, and every…they don't…you can't…it's a product that no longer exists because of Ugly Christmas Sweater Parties.

Dick: So you're fighting for all the people who want to just wear a Christmas sweater in peace?

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: Is this you? Do you want to go to Nordstrom's and pick up, like, just a normal Christmas sweater? (Maddox giggles) With plaid, like red and green plaid?

Maddox: You know, Dick, yes actually. (Dick guffaws) And I'll tell you why. I'll tell you why it's a problem. 'Cause for the last two years, and I think I may have time to do it this year, too, I've done a Christmas special for my YouTube channel.

Dick: Mhmm.

Maddox: And, uhh, last year was a case for the Grinch. And when I went out to buy a sweater for this episode, 'cause I didn't want to buy an ugly Christmas sweater, because I didn't…I wasn't going to one of these horseshit parties.

Dick: Right.

Maddox: I just wanted a Christmas sweater that evoked the spirit of Christmas without it also being a parody of Christmas. I just wanted to evoke that spirit, right?

Dick: Something genuine.

Maddox: Something genuine. It was SO fucking hard! Just finding a sweater. A normal sweater that looked like it could be a Christmas sweater, but also not a fucking ridiculous statement about Grandma.

Dick: Where'd you go?

Maddox: I went to a vintage thrift store. Actually, a bunch of 'em. It was really hard to find.

Dick: Seems like a breeding ground for, like, hipsters. A vintage thrift store in Hollywood?

Maddox: Well, I was looking for, specifically, a sweater from, like, the 90s, before ugly Christmas sweater parties took over.

Dick: Oh, I see.

Maddox: Because you can't find them anymore. They don't make them.

Dick: I don't…were there not ugly Christmas sweaters in the 90s?

Maddox: Of course, man. Look at Christmas movies before the 90s.

Dick: Right.

Maddox: People wore Christmas sweaters and they just look, like, red and green, and they had bells on them or snowflakes. They weren't necessarily obnoxiously ugly. They weren't abrasive and caustic to your aesthetic. They were just kind of goofy Christmas sweaters. Like, who cares?

Dick: You know what I wanna see? I wanna see if "Ugly Christmas Sweater Parties" is a bigger problem than "The Whole Virgin Birth Thing".

Maddox: Yeah, well. I guess that'll be one for the vote. To figure out which is the biggest problem in the universe, Dick. You guys vote on these to figure out which is the biggest problem, so we can figure out which one's the biggest.

Dick: Is that it? Do you have anything else for that? 'Cause we're out of time.

Maddox: Yeah, that's my whole…

Dick: We're totally out of time.

Maddox: You know, I just feel deflated. I know you guys are gonna fucking vote this down, along with Sony!

Dick: Yeah, 'cause it's fun!!

Maddox: You guys better not disappoint me!

Dick: It's fun to, like, wear an ugly Christmas sweater. (Maddox growls) You hate fun things sometimes.

Maddox: I love fun things, Dick.

Dick: Like what?

Maddox: Like video games. (Dick and Sean crack up) I like video games. Video games are fun. (Dick giggles) I like dogs. I do like dogs! I just don't want to own one, 'cause I don't want to carry dog shit around.

Dick: Oh, okay.

Maddox: Sean has a dog. Sean has a great dog. I love his dog. I just don't wanna carry its shit. Sean, nothing personal, I just don't want to carry the big steamy sacks…

Dick: (interjects) You're tired of getting shit on for hating dogs, aren't you? You're tired of getting shit on for hating dogs.

Maddox: I'm tired of stepping in dog shit.

Dick: Alllllright.

Maddox: I'm tired of dogs biting me. I'm tired of people treating dogs like family. They treat…they treat dogs better than they treat me.

Dick: Well, yeah! Uh…

Maddox: Consistently.

Dick: You know, your dog is better than people you don't know, to you.

Maddox: People know me. You know. They still treat me bad. (Dick giggles) My mom…with her gifts! I can't ever…I can't ever please anyone…okay, that's it, man.

Dick: Yeah.

Maddox: That's my…so, my problems this week were "Sony" and "Ugly Christmas Sweater Parties".

Dick: My problems are…I guess "Christmas Presents". I'm not gonna just be "Getting Guys Christmas Presents" now, right?

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: 'Cause you have…apparently you have the opposite problem, getting Christmas presents for women.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: So let's just get "Getting Christmas Presents".

Maddox: Dude, if I got you a video game for Christmas, would you be disappointed or upset?

Dick: No.

Maddox: Of course not.

Dick: And if I got you, uh…a dress…(Maddox laughs) and a…and a two-person nice vacation to somewhere…

Maddox: Yeah. (grinning)

Dick: Would you be upset by that?

Maddox: Well….no. Well, with half of it, yeah.

Dick: Yeah, okay.

Maddox: Yeah. But the vacation, man? I'll take a vacation any day. Anyway guys, stay tuned for the live show, coming up the first or second week of January. It's super exciting. Vote on these problems on the website.

Dick: Thanks for listening.

(Closing riff)

(Voice mail: "Hey guys, my name is Jay and I'm a social worker from Western Canada. I get paid alright for what I do, but because of where I live and what I do get paid, it's tough to always eat a balanced and healthy diet. There are days where I have tuna, ramen noodles, frozen vegetables to kind of keep myself in budget. If someone I'm talking to every gloats about feeding their fucking dog a four-star meal (Maddox: Yeah. Mhmmm) that includes fresh fucking salmon? I can assure you the conversation will abruptly end, because I figure it's probably hard to talk after you get punched in the throat. (Maddox giggles) Furthermore, while visiting my friend today, I asked his dog if he felt that his diet was sufficient, and he began licking his asshole. I guess his diet must be fine, then. Thanks guys.")

Maddox: Great. Great voice mail.

Dick: Licking his asshole.

Maddox: Yeah.

Dick: Here's a…here's a vet tech who agrees with you.

(Voice mail: (female voice) "Hey Maddox. Hey Dick. Um, my name's Lily and I've been a vet tech for almost seven years now. And I was calling about the gourmet dog food problem that Maddox brought in. Um, I've gotta agree with Maddox that high-end dog food is really all for the owner's peace of mind. (Maddox: Mhmm) Uh, it makes them feel good about themselves. (Maddox: Yep)They brag about it every single time they come into the hospital, like (Dick: That's what everything's for.) "Oooh, my dog gets premium, you know, salmon or steak, or whatever." (Maddox: Where was this at the start of the show, Dick?!) (Dick: I said! (Maddox laughs) Maddox: Dammit.) And uh, you know, it has a lot of veggies, and stuff like that. I mean, dogs are not in the wild eating green beans and shit, I mean… (Maddox: Yeah. (Dick cracks up) I know they don't use other dogs in dog food. Usually it's meat byproducts that people don't want, for the lower end stuff, anyways. (Maddox: Yeah.) Um, anyways! Dick, go fuck yourself! (Dick: Awww!)Uh, just kidding. I'll help you with that anytime. (Maddox and Dick: Ohhhhhhhh!!! (lascivious)) Love you guys. You're hilarious. Keep up the good work.")

Maddox: Heyyyy. Hubba hubba.

Dick: Riiiiiiiiiiiiiight!

Maddox: Wowwwww.

Dick: Ooooooooooooh, Merry Christmas (naughty voice)