Problem: Stoner Marketing [00:18:36]
Problem: Wage Theft [00:43:03]
Problem: People Texting In Public Walkways [01:08:27]
The Biggest Problem in the Universe - Episode 61
Transcription courtesy of: Megan Pennock
Maddox: Welcome to The Biggest Problem in the Universe, the show where we discuss every problem in the universe from horses to hiccups! (Dick cackles) With over 3.5 million downloads. This is the only show where you decide what should or shouldn't be on the big list of problems. I am Maddox, and with me is Dick Masterson.
Dick: Hey! What's up, buddy?
Maddox: And Sean, our audio engineer. (Dick still laughing)
Dick: Oh man, really rub it in.
Dick: Everybody hated horses, they hated sharks...
Maddox: No, they loved horses and sharks, apparently! Downvoted to oblivion.
Maddox: Let's just get this out of the way, man.
Maddox: (drumroll sound effect) Last week, the biggest problem in the universe was...Hiccups. (Dick and Sean laugh) Hiccups...hic-
Dick: (interjects) Oh, MAN.
Maddox: Hiccups. (crickets sound effect)
Dick: You gotta listen to the episode to believe it! (Maddox laughs) That's what I say.
Maddox: Hiccups, followed by -- and then these were all downvoted...
Maddox: ...Sharks, Horses, and French Bread. French Bread, the lowest of the three. NOBODY thought French Bread was a problem. Good! Enjoy your shitty bread, idiots!
Dick: I don't even really know what kind of bread you were talkin' about, still.
Maddox: Dick, have you... (laughing)
Dick: Not baguettes, right? (grins)
Maddox: They're -
Dick: (interjects) French bread is not baguettes. Is that wro-...is that right?
Maddox: Well, a baguette I think is something specific, but I think a baguette's another word for French bread.
Dick: Oh, man.
Maddox: How many different types of French bread are there? There's basically one. It's a baguette. It's the same thing.
Dick: I don't know. What was that chick's name in Amélie? That's a French bread I can get on board with, you know what I'm talkin' about? (slyly)
Maddox: Oh man, you're...no Dick, you're thinkin' "French broad." (laughs)
Dick: Oh. Oh, well, you're right. You're right, you're right.
Sean: Wasn't her name Amélie?
Maddox: Yeah! (laughs loudly)
Dick: I... (cracks up)
Maddox: ('ding!' sound effect)
Dick: I meant the actress. (Maddox still giggling) I meant the actress, Sean.
Maddox: Oh, okay! Uh-huh! (skeptical) Nice save.
Dick: I like to get to know BEHIND the character, you know? (Maddox and Sean laughing) I like to get to know the woman portraying the character.
Maddox: That's your secondary -
Dick: (interjects) That's just me.
Maddox: That's your secondary chute.
Dick: And how big her...her bra is. You know?
Maddox: That's the...that's the emergency parachute you pulled right there. (Dick laughs) Whew! Saved. Not really, though.
Dick: Well, I got a new song to celebrate me winning.
Maddox: Oh, you g-...?
Dick: 'Cause it's been a while. (background laughter)
Maddox: Oh, you got a song?
Dick: You wanna hear it? Yeah. [plays a cappella "Maddox Lost" song]
Maddox: I mean, it's not...you don't win in the show, but...
Dick: Here it comes. (grinning)
Male a cappella singers: Maddox...lost! Maddox...lost! Maddox...lost! Maddox...how'd he lose?? (Dick giggles) Maddox...lost! Maddox...lost! 'Cause his problems fucking suck!
Dick: They did. (Maddox laughing)
Male a cappella singers: Maddox...lost! Maddox...he lost! Maddox...how'd he lose to Dick? Maddox...
Male a cappella singers: Maddox...lost! Maddox...lost!
Maddox: Quit snapping your fingers, Sean!
Maddox: Diiiiiiiiiiiiiick is the winnerrrr! Oh, yeeeah.
Dick: Ahhhhh! (singing) Thank you. Thank you very much. (chuckling)
Maddox: (buzzer sound effect) What a DICK.
Dick: Zach Peterson.
Maddox: What a fuckin' asshole. That's a shit so-
Dick: (interjects) Zach Peterson made that.
Maddox: Zach Peterson? Garbage song, garbage...co-host. (laughs)
Dick: For those of you who don't know, that was an a cappella rendition of this song, which I used to play... [plays original "Maddox Lost" song ] (laughs with Sean)
Maddox: Okay. (annoyed) Fuckin' asshole.
(drums and electric guitar)
Dick (singing): Maddox LOST! Maddox LOST! Maddox LOST! Maddox LOST! 'CAUSE HIS PROBLEMS FUCKIN' SUCK!
Maddox: Augh! (Dick cackling) Ahh, what an asshole.
Dick (singing): Maddox LOST! Maddox LOST! Maddox LOST! Maddox LOST!
Maddox: Cock sucker. Don't...don't nod your head!! Sean!
Dick (singing): Maddox LOST! Maddox LOST! Diiiiiiiiiiick is the winnerrrrrrrr!
(song plays out with more drums and guitar)
Dick: Badass song.
Dick: Written by me, to celebrate my winning.
Maddox: Mhm. [song finally ends]
Dick: Lemme tell you why winning is important on this show.
Dick: Because if you didn't have the cost of a loss to dread, if you didn't have a victory to look forward to, we would get too many episodes full of sharks and horses and hiccups and horseshit.
Dick: That's why having a winner is important.
Maddox: Yeah, because when we...when the show's a contest, we don't risk bringing in, quote, "vote grab" problems, (Dick and Sean laugh) and then having the audience vote on whichever gimmick they wanna hear every week. That's stupid.
Maddox: Dick, uh, good songs, good songs.
Maddox: I also brought in a song today.
Maddox: I think you'll like this. This is by...Christoffer Strand.
Dick: I like that guy.
Maddox: Yeah. [plays "Small Face Dick" song]
Dick: He emailed me this. "Your face, Dick, is somewhat small for your head and chin. Looks too bulky." (Maddox and Sean laugh) So I g-...I gotta work on that. (laughs)
Maddox: Work on making your...work on your proportions, Dick. (giggling)
Dick: Work on the size of my face.
(slightly sad bassline, drums and piano)
Male singer: No one caaaaaaares
When your face is way too small
Drown my teeeeears
Dick: Oh, man. (Maddox laughing)
Male singer: In a world of alcohol
Spendin' money left and right
Dick: Yeah, bein' cool. (smiling)
Male singer: To forget just for one niiiiight
I'm Small Face Dick
Dick: So it's Charlie Brown's head, which is about the size of a half dollar, a silver dollar, and then my face is about the size of a dime.
Dick: In the middle of your pinkie fingernail.
Maddox: A tiny...a tiny little one. (laughing)
Dick: I don't know about...I don't like this one. I got a tiny face again.
Maddox: And then you have this tiny little face. I think it's pretty accurate.
Dick: Yeah. (annoyed) (Maddox and Sean laugh) It's not accurate.
Maddox: You know, Dick? I feel bad for you sometimes.
Maddox: Because you bring in these... (both crack up)
Dick: Why? 'Cause my face is too small for my head? (Maddox and Sean laugh loudly) It's a threesome of me.
Maddox: It's three dudes. (giggles)
Dick: And the god damn faces are SO small, you son of a bitch.
Dick: Ahhh. How long is this shit?
Maddox: Got another minute.
Dick: Yeah, I wish I could be happier that I won, but just hearing about my face again just pisses me off. It INSTANTLY pisses me off. I don't have a small face.
Dick: I DON'T HAVE A SMALL FACE.
Dick: I hate that stupid picture. I don't have a too small of a face for my head.
Dick: I don't have a small face! It's...
Maddox: I know, that's what he's saying!! He's saying he enlarged it for you.
Dick: No, I don't ha-...I get the joke. He made it extra small.
Maddox: What? (laughing)
Dick: Like the size of a mouth on my head, on my actual head. (Maddox laughs loudly) I don't have a too small of a face. At least I know this guy's face. Right?
Maddox: You know, Dick? With you, it's poker. You gotta put on your best bluffing tiny little face.
Dick: What the hell did...what did that mean?
Maddox: I don't know.
Maddox: Why don't you just wear a face mask and call it a day?
Dick: That doesn't work. No! 'Cause my face is little! It's on everything!
Maddox: Yeah. (smiling)
Dick: It's everywhere!
Maddox: You wear a gas mask.
Dick: You breathe it through the mask!
Maddox: Wear a gas mask like a fuckin' raver.
Dick: Wear a hazmat suit. That's the solution?
Maddox: Yeah. If it's a problem, you should wear a hazmat suit.
Dick: I'm an idiot, I sound like an idiot. You know how hard it is talking to a woman in bed...
Dick: Alright! (exasperated) (everyone laughs)
Dick: ...when your voice is all fucked up with too small of a face? The thing that bothers me most about it is that...
Dick: Why would I say that?!
Maddox: I...I don't know, man!
Dick: ...people are fixated on this standard of beauty. These people are obviously beautiful. I'm...I'm not!! I got a too small of a face! (Dick and Maddox laugh) I feel bad about that, you know? Like, oh, I got a hundred emails: "Dick, you're too ugly to live." (more laughing) Like, I really care! It's something that I value as a person.
Dick: You know what I mean?
Dick: I want it! I wanna see it!
Dick: But not having it is the end of the world. (Dick and Maddox laugh more) I can't even say that with a straight face.
Maddox: Ahh, that's it!
Dick: FUCK you.
Maddox: Ohoho, really?
Dick: 'Cause...fuck you, yeah. The "bags of sand" stuff is funny. The small face stuff is not funny.
Dick: It's too personal. (cracking up)
Maddox: Oh, it's t-... (giggles) Okay!
Dick: Look! Look.
Dick: Look, I don't have a small face.
Maddox: For the record.
Dick: For the record, I don't have a small face, and I'm gonna prove it. We're gonna get... (Maddox laughs) We're gonna get some kind of forensic artist. I just thought of this. We're gonna get some kind of forensic policeman artist in here to draw my face and see with science and calipers and rulers and ratios if it's actually a small face.
Dick: And it's fuckin' not. (angrily)
Maddox: Alright, Dick! That...I agree to this challenge. We're going to have a forensic artist in one of these episodes, and during the show they're gonna ha-...you're gonna be drawn, and we'll see if it's a normal-size face.
Dick: It's...right? That's a good way to prove it.
Maddox: That's fair. That's to-... (cracks up)
Dick: How else can you prove it?
Maddox: That's to-... (laughs more)
Dick: You can't use those stupid apps that you download to tell you if you're ugly or not, 'cause none of them work right.
Maddox: No, no.
Dick: I want a real human to judge me.
Maddox: That's fair. That's fair, Dick.
Dick: Whose job it is to note facial proportions!
Maddox: You know what's funny about that song, Dick, is -
Dick: (interjects) Nothing is funny! (Maddox and Sean laugh)
Maddox: Yeah! Enjoy, dickhead! I had to listen to your horseshit "Dick Won" songs for weeks and weeks and weeks.
Dick: Oh, thanks for reminding me. You've gotta watch Titanic later.
Maddox: Aw, fuckin' asshole. Um, I got a comment from Rauno Kyngäs. He says he "went to an Indian restaurant the other day and asked for french bread, turns out they had naan." (laughs)
Dick: Oh, god. (chuckles) I got some...somebody drew this, um...somebody 3D modeled a Sonic. Do you remember last week when we brought in those abortions that you were 3D modeling?
Maddox: They were masterpieces that I hadn't finished that you guys rudely criticized before it was finished!
Dick: How long did it take you, first of all, then?
Maddox: About an hour?
Dick: Okay, so where's...do you have the finished products yet?
Maddox: No, I'm still working on it.
Dick: Oh, okay. (laughing)
Maddox: It's a work in progress. Rome wasn't built in a day, buddy!
Dick: Well, it would've been if it looked like that. (Maddox and Sean laugh) Here is... (cracks up) Olomerol made this Sonic.
Dick: How 'bout that? You see that?
Maddox: Yeah, I give that -
Dick: (interjects) Looks pretty great, right?
Maddox: I give that an F!
Dick: You give that an F? What's wrong with it?
Maddox: Uh, that's...that's average.
Dick: Oh, this is average?
Maddox: That's average, yeah. I give it an F.
Dick: Okay. Is it average because it looks exactly like Sonic, or is it average because it doesn't have, like, a bunch of weird spines coming out the back like a retarded porcupine like yours was?
Maddox: Dick, mine had hair! It was realistic fur like an animal has! That's what Sonic is, a realistic animal. That looks like...first of all, Dick, are you seriously bringing that in as a good Sonic? That looks like garbage.
Dick: That's a great Sonic! That guy made it in 40 minutes!
Maddox: 40 minutes? Okay!
Dick: He started when we started talking about it.
Maddox: Alright dickhead, you're on! Who...what's that guy's name?
Dick: Uh, Olomerol.
Maddox: Ol-...what?!? What are you...what...??
Dick: He's @olomerol on Twitter.
Maddox: What is that, a fuckin' headache medicine? That's...
Dick: It's... (chuckles) I don't know. It's a Twitter handle.
Maddox: You know what, dickhead? You're on! You're on. I'm gonna make a speed run, alright? A speed run of 3D Sonic modeling, and I'll make it look better than that in under 40 minutes, guaranteed. Guaranteed.
Dick: Is this just a ploy to get people to subscribe to your Twitch channel?
Maddox: I don't give a shit!
Dick: So they can watch shitty 3D modeling?
Maddox: You know what? You know what? Unsubscribe. I don't give a FUCK. Here's the thing: I don't make any fuckin' money from Twitch. (cracking up) (Dick laughs) It doesn't fuckin' matter. Whatever. But tune in and watch, don't subscribe! I don't give a shit if you do or you don't.
Maddox: It's your loss if you don't!
Dick: Alright. Carl Lindberg says, "A group of preschoolers just wrote a book on 3D modeling called 'I Am Better Than Maddox.'"
Maddox: Yeah, real funny. Real funny joke. That's -
Dick: (interjects) Daniel Scutt says, "I'm liking the Blender. I didn't realize that was a render. Looks like a bulbous, tumorous balloon." You're right in making that mistake, Daniel. (Maddox belches)
Maddox: I got a comment from Raymond Christopher Lombardy. 3 names, fancy pants. (Dick chuckles) He says...he's from the Netherlands. He says, "It's impressive how fast Maddox moved from the shittiest non-problem French bread to yet another iPhone rant. 2.5 seconds?" And then he quotes me. He says, "'Horses are more dangerous than sharks,'" and then he called me a moron. He says, "What a moron." You know what, dickhead? Horses are more dangerous than sharks!
Maddox: You know how many people die from sharks every year? Under 6, worldwide!
Dick: Is that it?
Maddox: You know how many die from horses? About 20. Over 3 times!
Dick: They've never bitten any ladies' butts off though. Horses never have bit off an entire woman's butt. You know that's true.
Maddox: You don't...no, you don't know that.
Dick: Um, it's -
Maddox: (interjects) Horses eat ass all the time. They're voracious ass eaters. (Dick chuckles) I got a comment from Caleb Michael Gill. He says, "Did you guys seriously spend 30 minutes talking about whatever shit fans sent in and then spend what little time there was for discussing problems on the most pointless non-problems to date? Get your shit together."
Dick: Yeah, well, they put a lot of work into it, and it's interesting. It's the fan artworks.
Dick: Right? That's...I like talking about it.
Maddox: No, it was great! I mean, there were some naysayers. NAYsayers in the audience. (horse neighing sound effect)
Dick: Oho, my god.
Maddox: And they... (laughs) They were shitting on the episode, but I think a lot of people liked that episode. It was a fun episode.
Dick: By the way, you glazed...you glossed over that iPhone comment that you had a second ago. You got your ass tore up...
Maddox: No, I didn't!
Dick: ...on the comments and on Twitter.
Maddox: Oh no I didn't, dipshit!
Dick: Oh, Maddox.
Maddox: Did you even read that thread??
Dick: I read the whole thing and then I printed it out and jerked off on it, and then filmed that and put it on YouPorn and then jerked off to me jerking off on the argument.
Dick: That's how bad you got beaten up.
Maddox: First of all, that's the jizziest disgusting thing I've ever heard. (Dick giggles) And second, these fucking morons hit me up on Twitter. They said...first of all, they were trying to correct me on some technical jargon, which they know nothing about 'cause they've never developed shit in their fucking lives! (Dick laughs) So they...this guy was saying...this guy -
Dick: (interjects) Ohoho yeah, wait a minute. What have you developed? (grinning)
Maddox: I've developed tons of shit, dickhead!
Maddox: I wrote over 2,000 lines of code for my book! A fucking BOOK.
Dick: 2,000? Well, how much is in the iPhone? Like, what, 10,000?
Maddox: Well, considering...
Maddox: Considering the iPhone is an engineered product, I would hope more than that!
Dick: Okay. (about to laugh)
Maddox: But for a book you should write around...oh, I don't know, zero. But I wrote over 2,000 for a fucking book. But these dickheads...so they were trying to correct me on a technicality. They said that background applications don't run any code. Bullshit! Incorrect. I looked it up on the Apple website. ( buzzer sound effect)
Maddox: On the Apple developer website.
Maddox: That was a delayed... (cracks up) That was a delayed buzzer. It sounded like I buzzed myself. I looked it up on the Apple website, and of course it says it runs in the backg-...it runs instructions in the background, because it has to ping the servers to download new updates from Facebook and ads and Gmail ads and server ads.
Dick: I read the argument!
Dick: I think you got beaten up pretty good on it. I mean, I don't wanna get into it now...
Maddox: No rebuttal!
Dick: ...'cause I know you could talk...
Maddox: No rebuttal! No rebuttal.
Dick: ...for hours. Well, I -
Maddox: (interjects) Uh, speak-... (stammers)
Dick: Go ahead, go ahead.
Maddox: Speaking of talking for hours, Dick, I got a comment from Joel Bailey. This is about Smash Brothers.
Dick: Ugh, god.
Maddox: He sent me an email. He said, "Hey Maddox, as a former competitive player of Melee, winning several local tournaments at a large university, I know what I'm talking about when I say that Smash Brothers is not garbage. Garbage is too good for what Smash Brothers is."
Dick: Oh no.
Maddox: "Instead, Smash is moist garbage from a prison. The game doesn't punish whiffs. L-canceling is a bad mechanic since there is almost no situation you do not want to do it in. Watch a match and see how many strikes miss and don't get immediately punished." You know what he's talkin' about, Dick?
Dick: (scoffs) N-...video games?
Maddox: Counterattacks. "There's no high or low cross-up/mixup...there are only 4 buttons: Special, Normal, Jump, and Shield."
Maddox: "Jump doesn't even count, 'cause you press Up in most games to jump. Everything is based off of those, and the technical aspects of the games are a pain in the ass to incorporate and indicative of poor game design that causes most players to concentrate on learning tech skills instead of actually learning how to fight. On that last note, I wouldn't be so hard on Smash players if they didn't suck dick at their own game. They don't learn how to fight; they learn how to hit buttons." And on that note, Dick, I had a bunch of fans...fanboys!
Maddox: I'm not gonna call them fans. Fanboys...
Dick: Of Smash Brothers?
Maddox: ...of Smash Brothers coming up to me at Comic-Con.
Maddox: I was just...I just came back from Comic-Con, and they all came to me trying to defend Smash Brothers, and I came up with the best name for it. It's not Smash Brothers; it's Mash Brothers.
Dick: Mash Brothers. Great.
Maddox: 'Cause that's all you fuckin' do, is mash the controller in that fucking game. It's such garbage. So all these fanboys came over, and then they brought me their games to sign. (laughs)
Dick: Their Smash Brothers games to sign?
Maddox: Yeah, and I graded them all F-minuses. Garbage game, garbage players. This guy ends the email with this last thing. He says, "Smash players are all adults who act like children. The vehemently negative and childish response to calling Smash not a fighting a game is enough evidence of that." So yeah, there you go. He said, "There are some good players but the vast majority of players, i.e., your fans, are terrible." There you go!
Dick: So you're s-...so Smash Brothers is not a challenging game? Is that what the conclusion we're ending on is?
Maddox: It's not a f-...it's not a fighting game.
Dick: It's not up to your standard of fighting game?
Maddox: It's not a fighting game.
Dick: Oh, it's not a fighting game at all?
Maddox: No, no.
Dick: Okay. It's a button-mashing game.
Maddox: It's an experiment. It's an experiment. The president of Nintendo recently died. I believe the cause was of shame for releasing Smash Brothers.
Dick: I didn't know that.
Maddox: Yeah, very tragic. Very tragic.
Dick: Okay, so...so we'll get back to the Street Fighter challenge then?
Dick: I brought in...
Maddox: Great. (chuckling)
Dick: ...a video...
Dick: ...of Matt Bahr.
Maddox: Uh-huh? (smiles)
Dick: He played Street Fighter and recorded it.
Maddox: Okay. (laughing) Oho, alright!
Dick: And sent it in.
Maddox: Oh, let's see this!
Dick: Are you interested? See, now here's why I brought it in: because I think that the fans deserve to decide whether or not he's good enough to challenge you. You know what I'm saying?
Dick: Like, not anybody can just come in and challenge you to a Street Fighter fight.
Maddox: They can try.
Dick: Well, they can try, but is this...is this something -
Maddox: (interjects) They're not worthy! They're not worthy.
Dick: We need to know if he's worthy or not.
Dick: Before we continue with this, uh, farce of setting up this stupid fight.
Dick: Between Street Fighter.
Dick: So I'm gonna let you watch a little bit of it.
Dick: And then I'm gonna post it on the post... (Maddox laughs) ...or wherever, and let people comment on -
Maddox: (interjects) I know where this is goin', you fuck.
Dick: It's not! I'm not playing Titanic!
Maddox: Okay, alright!
Dick: I'm not playing Titanic.
Dick: I'm actually playing you...clips of Matt Bahr.
Maddox: Eh, that's not what I thought, but let's see it.
Dick: No, it is!! Look! (Maddox sighs wearily) [plays Matt Bahr's Street Fighter video]
(synth music from Street Fighter selection screen)
Dick: That's...that's Street Fighter.
Dick: 'Kay? (Maddox laughs) [pauses video] I'm gonna skip...I'm gonna skip in a little bit.
Maddox: I know exactly what this is, you fucker. I know what this is.
Dick: [resumes video] It's not...it's nothing stupid!
Maddox: (grins) I know...I know when it's myself playing the fuckin' game!
Dick: It's not you playing the game!!
Maddox: (yells over Dick) It's just a recording of Twitch, you fuckin' asshole! This is me playing! (laughing)
Dick: Maddox, it's not! It's... (breaks down laughing) You paranoid fuck! This is literally Matt Bahr playing the game!
Maddox: Yeah. (skeptical)
(Street Fighter music and fighting sounds)
Dick: What do you think so far?
Maddox: I mean, I'm winning! I/he is winning.
Dick: Maddox...hold on. Hold on, hold on. [pauses video]
Maddox: That's not...this is...is this...?
Dick: This is...stop shouting for a second. This is Matt Bahr playing!
Dick: This is not you!
Dick: Not everything is a con! (Maddox shrugs) This is a legitimate, like, prize fight to me. [resumes video]
(more game music and fighting sounds)
Voice-over: You win! Round 2! FIGHT!
Maddox: So he's playing Street Fighter Alpha. He's Ryu. He's cheaping.
Dick: Oh, he's cheaping? (Maddox laughs smugly at the fight) It's not you!! It's not you! I swear to God, it's not you.
Maddox: Yeah. Well okay, when do they -
Dick: (interjects) I mean, I swear to Ron Paul that it's not you. (Maddox laughs) I swear to the, uh, block chain that it isn't you.
Maddox: Yeah. (fighting sounds continue) Okay, this -
Dick: (interjects) Any impressions at all?
Maddox: I can tell whether or not it's me playing in just a minute.
Dick: Jesus Christ! (laughing)
Maddox: Well -
Dick: (interjects) This is...
Maddox: I mean, look, there's nothing impressive going on here. This looks like...
Maddox: This looks...okay. Here's the thing.
Dick: That was a pretty good leg sweep.
Maddox: He did...
Voice-over: You win!
Maddox: Whoever's playing here, he did 3 leg sweeps in a row.
Dick: That's a cheap.
Maddox: And when I was playing on my computer, not all the buttons were working.
Dick: [stops Street Fighter video] Okay.
Maddox: So that MIGHT be me playing. (Dick giggles) I think it's me!
Dick: God dammit.
Maddox: I think you were trying to trick me.
Dick: No, I'm not tryin' to trick you!
Maddox: Okay, well...okay. Bottom line is, whatever that little demo, that little blurb?
Maddox: That you showed me?
Maddox: Not impressive.
Dick: That's him!
Maddox: Yeah. It...
Dick: It's not a joke. Go -
Maddox: (interjects) That's for real him?
Dick: That's for real him, yes!!
Maddox: Alright. Alright! Not impre-...really not impressive.
Dick: Alright, you fuckin' weirdo. (laughing)
Maddox: 3 leg sweeps in a row. Garbage.
Dick: Go ahead.
Maddox: Shit. (muttering)
Dick: You wanna do a...do you wanna do a problem or do you have more stuff to read?
Maddox: Yeah Dick, I got a problem.
Maddox: My first problem this week, and possibly the biggest problem in the universe, is stoner marketing.
Maddox: Stoner marketing. You know what that is, Dick?
Maddox: Sean? You probably...yeah? Of course Sean knows. I hate st-
Sean: (interjects) God dammit.
Dick: Yeah. (chuckling) You...that's what you get!
Sean: I walked right into that one.
Maddox: Yeah. (laughs)
Sean: It's like the late-night Jack In The Box commercials.
Dick: Oh, it is?
Maddox: Yeah, basically. So I...guys, I hate stoner marketing. It's about as insincere as a gesture gets. Corporations are diametrically opposed to stoners and stoner culture, right? Yet they have no problem co-opting stoner culture like a dad turning on a hip-hop station while he drops off his daughter at a school dance.
Maddox: These companies aren't cool. (Dick giggles) They're cool adjacent. (Sean chuckles in the background)
Maddox: Right? You know, like, how some people...people who don't live in California might not know this, but anyone who lives in a province or a city next to Beverly Hills tends to call their city "Beverly Hills adjacent."
Maddox: Which is the douchiest try-hard, wannabe, loser name you can call a city, is adjacent to something else.
Maddox: "Adjacent" means "loser."
Dick: Well, it tells you where it is though.
Maddox: Well, you know where it is because of the name of the city, Dick.
Dick: What do you mean? You can't say...
Dick: ..."Malibu adjacent"? How would you say it?
Maddox: I wouldn't say "Malibu adjacent," 'cause that would... (stammers)
Dick: What would you say?
Maddox: (yells) "Malibu adjacent" tells me nothing! It could be north, south, east...well, not west, 'cause it's on the coast, but if you say "Beverly Hills adjacent" it tells you literally nothing about which city you're in, dickhead.
Dick: It tells you that you're right next to the city!
Maddox: Which? North, south, east, west? Which one?! Which city, dickhead??
Dick: I don't know.
Maddox: There's like 5 cities that are Beverly Hills adjacent, it's garbage! That's what stoner...that's what stoner marketing does. It's not cool; it's cool adjacent. (Dick laughs to himself) It's a common marketing strategy. What?
Dick: So you use the term to describe "cool adjacent."
Dick: 'Cause it's obviously of some use.
Maddox: No, no, no. It's not of use, Dick.
Maddox: I'm telling you specifically that the companies use it to try to look cool.
Dick: Right, okay.
Maddox: Right? It's a common marketing strategy to take a lame brand and put it adjacent to a hip brand in hopes that the hip brand's coolness will rub off on the lame brand. That's why you get NFL stars appearing in Campbell's Soup commercials. Nobody thinks cream of mushroom soup is cool, but take a winning NFL player and shovel a spoonful of soup into his airplane hanger like a toddler and suddenly Campbell's stock prices go up. The worst part of this though, Dick, is the insincerity. I can't stand the insincerity here. It's that these corporations have these strict anti-drug policies in their companies, and they wouldn't hesitate to fire any one of their employees in a heartbeat for doing drugs, yet they have no problem pandering to the stoner crowd. Did you know Taco Bell -
Dick: (interjects) Well, wait a minute.
Dick: Who is the stoner...what's an example of one of these stoner ads?
Maddox: Oh, thank you for asking, Dick!
Maddox: I was about to tell you. You know Taco Bell has a 420-calorie cheesy bean and rice burrito on their menu?
Maddox: In addition to their blatant "fourth meal" commercials. You know those "fourth meal" commercials?
Dick: Oh, I do know them. I guess I didn't necessarily think they were for stoners.
Maddox: Oh yeah, they're for stoners, Dick. In fact, um...
Maddox: Here, I'm gonna play a commercial for you, and there's supposedly some subliminal messaging in, uh, in these commercials, some people think 5 seconds into this. Listen to this...uh, this ad. 5 seconds into this.
Dick: Oh, is there a bong rip in it?
Maddox: Sounds like there's a bong rip!
Dick: Okay, alright.
Maddox: And also, people even go so far as to suggest that the 'bong' at the end of, uh...you know, that bell?
Maddox: That rings at the end of the commercials? Is them trying to say "bong" at the end of the commercials. Here, listen to this. [ plays Taco Bell commercial]
Singer: I got the late-night munchieeeees...
(music with reggae vibe plays, along with a short noise that sounds vaguely like someone inhaling)
Dick: Ohhhohohohoho! (giggling)
Maddox: You hear that?
Dick: That sounds like a doob.
Maddox: Sounds like it!
Singer: ...late night munchieeees. 'Bong!'
Maddox: But it's innocuous enough that you could kinda skirt by it without sayin' that it's definitely a bong rip.
Dick: Yeah, huh.
Maddox: Those motherfuckers. Subliminal messa-...and then at the...they have that bell at the end that sounds like "bong." Um...and their 420-calorie cheesy bean and rice burrito, which is just garbage. It's reconstituted powder shit.
Dick: Yeah, I don't eat Taco Bell.
Maddox: Oho. (chuckling) Yeah, far be it for you, as you're sittin' here with an empty bag of McDonald's in front of you. (smiles)
Dick: Chicken nuggets I'll eat. I like a good nugget.
Maddox: Well, there you go. That's reconstituted chicken.
Dick: Yeah. (shrugging)
Dick: Still good. (Maddox laughs)
Maddox: No, it's NOT good. It's garbage.
Dick: Tastes good. (smiles)
Maddox: Okay. (about to laugh) Well, that'll be another problem some other time. (Dick laughs) Dick, this is from TheFix.com. "General Mills, which revived Cheech and Chong for a Fiber One web campaign, deemed the ad so successful it plans to do more just like it."
Maddox: And here's what that web campaign sounds like. [plays Cheech and Chong Fiber One ad]
(electric guitars in background)
Voice-over (movie trailer style): Cheech and Chong's Magic Brownie Adventure. (Dick cackles loudly) Join them in their quest to deliver thousands of magic brownies to Flaming Pole.
Tommy Chong: Flaming Pole is wild, man!
Maddox: Idiots. Idiots, idiots, idiots. And yet, they have a legal team the size of a small nation to enforce laws and their rights, U.S. laws. Are anti-drug laws part of the laws their lawyers enforce? No, of course not!! Are they going to bat for you if you get busted for drug use that their own commercials encourage? No! Of course not! The same company that markets oatmeal, organic crackers and low-fat yogurt is pandering to people who use lysergic acid. These guys are the ones? It's as insincere a gesture as it gets, and I don't even give a shit about stoners. I'm not a stoner, I don't do drugs, but this is just an insincere cash grab. These fuckers don't give a shit about anyone or anything except for their bottom line.
Maddox: They're selling organic crackers and low-fat yogurt, and also pandering to drug users. And yet, if any of their employees so much as fail a piss test, out the fuckin' door. These guys!
Dick: Is that your problem with it? That they don't...that they're capitalizing on drug use but they don't tolerate it in their company?
Maddox: It's insincere. My biggest problem with it is that it's insincere, AND by promoting stoner culture, it is promoting anti-intellectualism. That's what that is.
Dick: You know, a lot of drug users have been some of the biggest intellectuals of our time.
Maddox: Right. Not -
Dick: (interjects) Alotta scientists are pretty heavy drug users.
Maddox: Yeah, but not...not most of the drug users you and I know. Not -
Dick: (interjects) Well, most PEOPLE aren't.
Dick: But it's not...drug users are not necessarily anti-intellectual.
Maddox: Well, that's true. That's not necessarily the case, but it's not... (stammers) It's probably the exception, not the rule. I think that smart people...uh, people are smart in spite of drugs, not because of drugs.
Dick: Yeah. I mean, obviously I don't agree with that, but, uh...
Maddox: Oho, obviously. (sneering)
Dick: Well, it's just a hell of a claim to make, that...that it's a deficiency, doing drugs is somehow a deficiency on these guys' part.
Dick: Like they're less intellectual.
Maddox: Yeah, they're not necessarily less intellectual, Dick. BUT, more likely than not, the people who do a lot of drugs, the ones that I know in real life...
Maddox: ...are a little bit slow. They don't have...they're not too interested in anything...any intellectual pursuits. They don't have...they're not very motivated to go to college. They're not very motivated to...you know. They're not go-getters.
Maddox: Like, nobody I know who has really hustled to get a job at, say, Goldman Sachs, smokes more than once a day. Right?
Dick: Smokes weed?
Dick: Oh, yeah, okay.
Maddox: So, generally. And there have been studies that show that smoking a lot of weed reduces your ambition, your motivation to do things.
Maddox: That's why Taco Bell recently...more of this fuckin' stoner marketing! They recently announced that they're starting a delivery service to bring the munchies right to your fuckin' door. "Munchies," I fucking hate that word! By the way, guys...you know what you're eating, Sean? I bring in snacks to the show all the time. Before the show starts, snacks and drinks, 'cause I'm very generous.
Dick: 'Cause you like to ruin the audio quality of our voices.
Maddox: Hah, yeah. Great. (shouts) Way to shit on a nice ge-... (Dick giggles) You know what? Fuck you, Dick! You're not gettin' any more snacks and drinks! ( buzzer sound effect)
Dick: Oh, good! (laughing)
Maddox: GOOD. 'Cause you never fuckin' offer me any anyway, dickhead. (stammers angrily) These guys both come in sometimes, Starbucks -
Dick: (interjects) To set up.
Maddox: Starbucks in hand, Coca-Colas and snacks and drinks, and I'm like...
Maddox: ..."Hey guys, how 'bout me? Anything for me?" Nope, nothing! (buzzer sound effect) Assholes. Sean, you're eating...Munchies, right now. I got Flamin' Hot Munchies that are a combination of Rold Gold, Doritos, Cheetos, and Sun Chips. Munchies!
Dick: Yeah, I guess my problem with this, or why I don't think it's as big of a problem as you do, is that...it's just a weed, man.
Dick: And, like, so what if they're marketing to people who like smokin' weed?
Maddox: Because it's insincere, Dick. Did you ignore the entire first half of this problem where I said that they would fire their employees and wouldn't hesitate to enforce all the other laws of this land??
Dick: Yeah, but that's changing. Like, the weed...weed is changing as slowly as gay marriage is. It's getting legalized, it's getting decriminalized. In the near future, it will be...it'll be totally legal, I think.
Maddox: Oh, oh. (sarcastic)
Dick: And it's gonna take the law to catch up to that. So at that point is it okay? 'Cause then they...you know what I'm saying?
Maddox: Yeah, um...yeah, I know what you're saying, Dick, but I'm not sure YOU know what you're saying. [plays "Dick Versus Dick" intro]
(ritzy game show theme music)
Dick: Oh, boy. (Maddox laughs smugly)
Deep Voice (reverb): Dick...Versus...Diiiiiiick!
[intro fades out]
Maddox: Dick, you remember way back when in the, quote, "bicyclers" episode?
Maddox: You said, uh, you're pissed off at cyclists because they don't respect the laws, man! (dumb voice)
Dick: Yeah, they don't.
Maddox: They don't stop at red lights, they don't stop at stop signs.
Dick: They ride on the sidewalk.
Maddox: And yet here you are, totally okay -
Dick: (interjects) They go across crosswalks.
Maddox: Totally okay with people doing illegal drugs. Which is it?
Dick: Well, I don't think that weed should be illegal!
Maddox: Okay. There you go!
Dick: So what's the...what's the difference? I think that, um -
Maddox: (interjects) Well, cyclists don't think that they should have to stop at 4-way stops when they...
Maddox: ...when there are no cars around.
Dick: Well, when there are no cars around. I mean, then...that's different, but as a general rule they should have to obey traffic laws, and they don't.
Maddox: Oh, I agree! (stammers) No, they do!
Dick: No they don't!
Maddox: They do!
Dick: They totally don't.
Maddox: They do!!
Dick: They bike right through intersections all the time.
Maddox: Yeah, bullshit! Then how come they're not killing 30,000 people a year like cars are, dickhead? There's a vid-...you just...I sent you several YouTube videos -
Dick: (interjects) It's hard to kill a guy on a bicycle.
Maddox: No shit! Exactly! That's why it's not a fuckin' problem. And that's the exact same argument people use for marijuana legalization!! They say it's not killing anyone! (yelling)
Dick: It's not!
Maddox: Yet when it comes to cyclists: "Oh, it's a big fuckin' problem." 'Cause Fancy Pants in his car...
Dick: But it's causing accidents!
Maddox: ...in his air-conditioned car...it's not causing accidents!
Dick: It's causing injuries and accidents.
Maddox: It's NOT causing accidents.
Dick: Yes, it is!
Maddox: No, it's not!! Less than 5%...I would say less than 3% -- I don't know if it's 5% or 3% -- of accidents are caused with a pedestrian...excuse me, a motorist hitting a cyclist.
Maddox: It's non-existent.
Dick: That's a lot!
Dick: That's a lot. 3% of accidents?? That's a lot of accidents!
Maddox: You know what's actually a lot, Dick? 97%, which is not caused by cyclists.
Dick: Yeah, alri-... (stammers)
Dick: I know you got a hard-on for bicyclers, but I think that they should obey the law.
Maddox: You're skirting...
Dick: And that's...
Maddox: You're skir-
Dick: (interjects) What do you think the issue is?
Maddox: The issue is -
Dick: (interjects) What issue am I skirting?
Maddox: You're saying that you're o-...you want...you're selectively choosing which laws you're okay with. So this is like Dick Masterson's world.
Dick: (yells) Yeah, welcome to democracy, shithead!
Maddox: Ye-...ohh! (sneering)
Dick: I'm absolutely choosing which laws I think are just and unjust.
Maddox: Ohhh! Oh, okay. So when you're complaining about cyclists, you don't think that they should have a choice on which laws they decide to observe, right?
Dick: Of course not!!
Maddox: Just what...okay, just Dick's.
Dick: They should have to follow the traffic laws!
Maddox: Yeah. They mostly do, Dick.
Dick: But they don't a lot.
Maddox: Yeah, yeah. (sarcastic)
Dick: That's why I brought it in as a problem.
Maddox: Yeah. Well, when cyclists -
Dick: (interjects) 'Cause they ride their bikes down the street and f-...
Dick: ...and hurt people.
Maddox: Yeah. When cycli-
Dick: (interjects) And hurt themselves!
Maddox: Nah, they don't hurt themselves and they don't hurt people.
Dick: And cause accidents!
Maddox: They don't. Yeah, there's a -
Dick: (interjects) Yes, they do!
Maddox: There's a non-stop...there are so many videos on YouTube of cars running red lights and killing people. There's THOUSANDS of them.
Dick: Maddox, no one is debating that cars are dangerous.
Maddox: Yeah! Yeah. (sneering)
Dick: No one here.
Dick: You're bringing that up like it proves a point, but it doesn't!
Dick: Obviously, cars are dangerous. It's a controlled explosion used by someone who's Tindering!
Dick: That's a huge problem!
Dick: Very dangerous!
Maddox: Okay! (cynical)
Dick: All bicyclers have to do is not bicycle on the sidewalk. That's all we're asking!
Maddox: Yeah. I'm... (stammers) You know, maybe after this episode you can make a list of which laws we should and shouldn't obey.
Dick: All of them!! You sh-...on your bicycle, you should obey all of the laws! (shouting)
Maddox: Oh, okay. Yeah.
Dick: Just like in a car you should obey all of the laws, except for the posted speed limits because that's not the actual law!
Maddox: And you know what's ironic, is, uh...you're totally okay with breaking all the laws on a cycle while doing drugs at Burning Man.
Dick: I'm okay with... (Maddox laughs) ...breaking all the laws on a bicycle?
Maddox: That's what everyone does at Burning Man, just drugs and rides around on bikes.
Dick: Well, I don't know how...what to say to that. What are you saying? That we're breaking bicycle laws by driving around while intoxicated?
Maddox: You're breaking a lot of laws at Burning Man.
Dick: On a bicycle?!
Maddox: Yeah! On a bicycle or otherwise.
Dick: There's no roads at Burning Man!
Maddox: Yeah. Well, is it okay to do drugs while you're riding around?
Dick: It's illegal!
Maddox: Yeah, it's illegal. Alright.
Maddox: So...and by the way -
Dick: (interjects) Oh wait, what did you prove there?? It's illegal! Don't do it!
Maddox: Yeah. Okay, so are you talkin' about drugs, or...or what?
Dick: I'm talking about...driving a bicycle while intoxicated.
Dick: It's very dangerous...
Maddox: Ohhh. (sarcastic)
Dick: ...and it's illegal!
Dick: Don't do it!
Maddox: How many...you know how m-
Dick: (interjects) Doing drugs in your own home? No big fuckin' deal, man!
Maddox: Yeah, yeah.
Dick: Do it!
Maddox: But we're getting way off topic here. But you know -
Dick: (interjects) Oh, yeah!
Maddox: There's, uh..."There's Sonic and its hallucinating twenty-someth-..." This...again from TheFix.com. "There's Sonic and its hallucinating twenty-something dreaming of man-sized cheesy tots. Carl's Jr. is touting its 'wake and bake' habit." (Dick and Sean laugh)
Dick: Yeah. (amused)
Maddox: Again, another company that has strict anti-drug policy. Denny's is promoting a reggae-loving unicorn, and Jack In The Box has a Munchie Box that they sell with a commercial suggesting that "things get weird at night," which is basically their attempt at sending subtle messages to stoners, like "We get you!" NO! You don't get stoners. Corporations are about as stiff and anti-drug as it gets. And here's that commercial, by the way, Dick. [ plays Jack In The Box Munchie Meal commercial]
(upbeat dance music in background)
Jack In The Box mascot: Why is there a grilled cheese riding piggyback on a cheeseburger?
Jack In The Box mascot: Why? 'Cause things get weird late at night. That's why I make the Munchie Meal! It's a box fulla crazy craveables like the Stacked Grilled Cheese Burger or Chick-n-Tater Melt, plus Halfsie fries, 2 tacos and a drink, all for just 6 bucks. So get one tonight, and get weird.
('whoosh' sound effect from closing logo)
Dick: They pay for that ad?
Maddox: Did you hear that bong rip at the end too?
Dick: No. No, play it again.
Maddox: Yeah, listen to this. This is right at...
Dick: Just the end.
Maddox: ...right at the end. Right here. [replays end of commercial]
Jack In The Box mascot: ...plus Halfsie fries, 2 tacos and a drink, all for just 6 bucks. So get one tonight, and get weird.
('whoosh' sound effect from closing logo)
Dick: Oh, you thought that was a bong rip? (incredulous)
Maddox: That sound like it?
Dick: That just sounds like a whoosh.
Maddox: Okay! (Dick imitates 'whoosh' sound) Maybe it's a whoosh, maybe it's a...well, who knows? Subtle.
Dick: Well... (shrugs)
Maddox: Subtle. Could be. (Dick laughs) Dick, uh, my big problem with this is the insincerity of these corporations. They don't give a shit about stoners or any...or ANYONE.
Maddox: They JUST care about their bottom line, and that's...I think why your Corporation solution was voted down. And this is continued from The Fix. They said, "'If you're targeting...'" This is a quote from a brand consultant. He says, "'If you're targeting that heavy fast food user you need to speak their language,' says Denise Yohn, a brand consultant who's worked with restaurants for 25 years. 'One way to do that is to talk about partying and munchies.'" They...
Maddox: They are...they're pandering! That's all this is. "'To the mainstream audience it may just sound like late nights and drinking, but to a certain audience they're talking about getting stoned."
Maddox: It's insincere, Dick.
Dick: Well, what kinda ad would you like? Lemme ask that. Like, what kinda ads...? 'Cause I know you hate...you hate ads where companies do charity and then say that they did it.
Maddox: Yeah, 'cause it's insincere.
Dick: Why? So if...what if they said "we only did that so you guys would feel good and associate our name with that good feeling"?
Maddox: That'd be ho-
Dick: (interjects) Would that be an okay ad?
Maddox: That would be honest, yeah.
Dick: So if these guys said...what would these guys have to say to market to stoners? Or do you think that they just shouldn't market to stoners?
Maddox: Here's who I think should be marketing to stoners.
Maddox: People who sell stoner paraphernalia...
Maddox: ...people who se-...bongs.
Dick: Bongs or, like, blacklight posters? Do you mean paraphernalia like bongs and pipes, or do you mean, like...
Maddox: Bongs, pipes...
Dick: ...socks with weed leaves on 'em?
Maddox: Weed leaves on posters, that sort of thing. People who are selling those products?
Maddox: Those...their interests align with the stoners' interests. They are actually selling stoners their products, that the stoners actually wanna buy. An honest ad is this: basically, you sell a customer a product that they want for a reasonable price. (Dick smirks) And you don't mislead them.
Maddox: And you don't pander to them, and you don't dumb...you don't talk down to them, which is exactly what these ads are doing to stoners. Munchies is so...there are so many products out there, it's just kind of subtly taken over the market, Dick. There used to be extreme marketing. Extreme -
Dick: (interjects) I remember that!
Maddox: Yeah. Extreme, I think, was the original stoner marketing.
Maddox: Because people who are really into extreme sports and extreme whatever...
Dick: That was definitely cool adjacent.
Maddox: Yeah. (chuckling) Very cool adjacent. They were... (stammers) And I wrote an article about it on my website a long time ago, the...
Dick: Yeah, it was funny.
Maddox: ...the Corn Nuts.
Maddox: Extreme Corn Nuts? Go into a grocery store or convenience store or liquor store and look at the snacks they're selling. Almost all of 'em have some kind of munchie, or some kind of, like, stoner all-...it's coded! It's coded messages that they have that they're sending to stoners, and they don't...they don't give a shit about stoners, and they don't understand stoners. These people are corporate suits. They don't under-...they couldn't be more removed from stoners or stoner culture.
Dick: But some of them ARE stoners.
Maddox: I don't think so.
Dick: But they're people!
Dick: Like, most people...most people smoke weed.
Maddox: I would define...I wouldn't define them as stoners. Like, my friend's mom smokes weed because she has, um...she's actually had some eye sur-...some back problem or eye surgery or something. She smokes weed to help alleviate her chronic pain condition, and it's actually helped. But she doesn't smoke weed recreationally, and I wouldn't classify somebody who smokes occasionally as a stoner either.
Maddox: I'm talkin' about specifically someone who considers drugs and partying with drugs as a lifestyle.
Maddox: Those are stoners.
Dick: Yeah. I got...I'll say two things about this stoner marketing thing.
Dick: Uh, I don't think that's entirely a stoner ad. I think they might've co-opted some of the messaging, like from the late-night culture?
Dick: 'Cause there was a...what was the thing, a cheeseburger riding a unicorn or something? Or a cheese sandwich riding a unicorn? I don't know if that's stoner necessarily or just like, "I'm so random."
Maddox: Yeah, well, if you watch the commercial it's very, um...it's very psychedelic.
Dick: It's very stoner-y. Okay.
Maddox: It's very stoner-y. They have a lot of, um...you've seen Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas, right? One of your favorite movies?
Dick: Uh, yeah! I get really fucked up and watch that all the time. (Maddox snickers)
Maddox: Well, there you go.
Dick: It's awesome and cool.
Dick: Yeah. (grins)
Maddox: And you know the surreal imagery that's...
Maddox: ...that you find in that movie?
Maddox: They use some of that in these commercials.
Dick: Oh, okay.
Maddox: Surreal imagery.
Dick: Oh, so that's...that's definitely playing to drug usage.
Maddox: Yeah. It's very...it's very much so.
Dick: Well, then I would say I'm in big support of it, because the more, um...
Dick: ...the more commonplace that drug usage is, the more likely it is to be legalized. The more common...the more commonly that, like, TV shows talk about smoking pot and the more you see it in ads, the more you see marijuana just used in...in, uh, pop culture, the easier it is for it to be legalized.
Maddox: Do you -
Dick: (interjects) And I think that'd be a huge win.
Maddox: Do you have a problem with these companies hypocritically enforcing drug laws and then still marketing to drug users?
Dick: Well... (exhales) No. For, like, fast food...for fast food restaurants to be enforcing drug laws? I don't have a problem with that.
Dick: Because it's the nature of their employment that, uh...like, 'cause they're all...they're minimum-wage...
Dick: ...people? I think that, um...it's...once you see...like if you see habitual drug use on minimum-wage employees?
Dick: Um...it makes sense for them in the long run to either warn 'em or terminate 'em.
Dick: Right? 'Cause turnover is incredibly high in those businesses. They're worked...they're worked very hard. It's different than, like, a design shop where s-...or, like, a white-collar job or whatever the other collars are?
Dick: These days?
Dick: Where people can...people can get high...like, some... (brief pause) You don't want at a Taco Bell somebody getting high on their break and then coming back to work, and then costing you a shitload of money 'cause they either get hurt or they f-...they, like, fuck up somebody's order really badly. Like...I don't know, it's just manual labor.
Maddox: It's bad. It's bad to have...
Dick: Yeah, it's bad for business.
Maddox: ...stoners working for you, right? Okay.
Dick: Who's somebody who's getting stoned at work, or... (sighs) Eh, you know. I don't know, are they testing for people who are getting stoned on their own time?
Maddox: Well, if you have smoked a joint and it shows up in your blood, in your urine test, it doesn't matter when you smoked it. It's still going to test positive, and you're still going to lose your job.
Dick: I think there's different types of tests. Like, they can test you for what you've done for the last couple months. Um...I don't like drug testing in terms of employment, but I can see wh-...I can see how it works sometimes. Like, I don't know, I'm not running that kind of business, so.
Maddox: So you're...you think they should be fired though?
Dick: Well, I think that they can do whatever they want. Like, it's not -
Maddox: (interjects) What do you think, Dick? Do you think they should be fired or not?
Dick: I'm not running a Taco Bell! It's hard for me to say.
Maddox: Well, you have an opinion!
Dick: That they fired them? They probably had a good reason to do it.
Maddox: You think it's good that they fired them?
Dick: I think that they probably had a good reason to do it. I don't know how to say it's good or bad.
Dick: Like, they made the decision. If it's...I'll put it this way: if it's not good for business and a competitor like Del Taco DOESN'T fire people...
Dick: ...who test positive for drugs, then Del Taco's gonna get cheaper employees.
Dick: And it's...and they'll win in the long run.
Dick: So I...I don't know.
Maddox: You don't have a problem with companies that enforce drug laws on their employees and make sure that their employees don't do drugs...
Dick: Well, let's see.
Maddox: ...and yet you're okay with them also pandering to stoners who do lots of drugs and then get fired from these very same jobs. What kind of jobs do stoners get?
Dick: I don't think I said the first part that you're saying I said. I don't like drug testing. Like, that's...that's the first thing I said.
Maddox: So how are they supposed to know if their employ-...? Dick, you just said two different things! You said on one hand, you're okay with them getting fired and doing drug testing because you need to know if their employees are gonna be going out smokin' a joint on their breaks or whatever and then potentially being a liability to the company.
Dick: Well, yeah, but -
Maddox: (interjects) And then on the other hand you said, "Well, I don't like drug testing." So which is it?
Dick: Well, I don't like drug testing, but that's the law, so you can't make 'em stop doing it. Like, you can't -
Maddox: (interjects) You gotta enforce the law!
Dick: They can't...well, it's not about enforcing the law, but they can't fire somebody because they were drinking last night, 'cause it's legal to do that.
Dick: Like, if it was legal to smoke weed last night, they can't fire you for doing it.
Maddox: Yeah. Dick, it's not...
Maddox: ...it's not that they're firing people because it's illegal. They can choose whether or not they want to have this drug law enforced in their employment.
Maddox: They can CHOOSE that.
Dick: I think maybe you don't understand that. They can't. If you're doing something that's legal, they cannot fire you because you did it on your time.
Maddox: Well, that's true, they can't fire you for that reason. However, they can fire you if it affects your functioning at work. So if you come into work...
Dick: Well, of course.
Maddox: ...and you're totally hung over...right?
Dick: Yeah, then you can get fired, sure.
Maddox: So shouldn't that be the standard rather than some arbitrary drug testing?
Dick: Well, r-...right!
Dick: That's why I don't like drug testing.
Maddox: Okay. Yet you still encourage these companies hypocritically...
Dick: I don't encourage them, though.
Maddox: ...pandering! You're okay -
Dick: (interjects) Like, I know you're getting on your soapbox...
Maddox: You're okay... (cracks up)
Dick: ...but that's like...that's the -
Maddox: (interjects) You're okay with these companies pandering to stoners and yet still firing stoners. That's the problem I have with it.
Dick: Yeah. (unsure)
Maddox: It's insincere, it's bogus, it's bullshit. They don't give a fuck about anyone. I don't think General Mills cares one damn cent about any...any person they're selling to. I don't think they give a fuck.
Dick: Why do you think th-...did you ever think that they did? Like, there's no Santa Claus either!
Maddox: They give...they give that im-
Dick: (interjects) These companies don't give a shit about people.
Maddox: They give that impression. Dick, that's exactly the problem I have with Honda! Those Honda commercials pretending like they're doing some altruism. They don't care! They just don't care. They are trying to make themselves altruistic adjacent.
Maddox: They're trying to make themselves hip adjacent. "Hey guys, we're cool too! Buy our product. We get it. We get drugs." No, you don't! No you fucking don't, and you have hurt people's lives by firing them and doing drug testing and...
Maddox: ...coming down...these guys are the problem! They're the problem, and I really have a problem with them then suddenly turning around and trying to make a buck off the same people they're persecuting. Fuck that. That's my problem.
Dick: Well, yeah.
Dick: I agr-...that drug testing is a problem, I'll give you that.
Maddox: Yeah. Stoner, uh, st-
Dick: (interjects) I would rather it go this way than the other way though, where this didn't exist.
Maddox: What, the stoner marketing?
Dick: I would rather this exist and slowly weed out the drug testing. Like, you can't drop it overnight, but...I think it's going in the right way. Like, I think that stoner marketing is an indication that we're moving in the right way.
Maddox: That the...in illegalizing drugs?
Dick: Legalizing drugs.
Maddox: Er, excuse me. Yeah, legalizing drugs.
Maddox: Alright, well...that's, uh, that's a different debate, but that's my problem. Stoner marketing.
Dick: Hell of a problem.
Maddox: What you, uh, what you got?
Dick: I got wage theft. (Maddox scoffs and laughs)
Maddox: Okay. What do you, uh, what do you mean by "wage theft," Dick?
Dick: What's the over-under for libertarian comments on this one, Sean?
Dick: I got called a libertarian before the show. Full disclosure.
Sean: Well, you can't tell him now.
Dick: No, it'll still come out.
Maddox: It'll come out. (grinning)
Dick: It'll still come out. He doesn't care.
Sean: It probably will, but now it's... (Dick laughs)
Maddox: It's knee-jerk, Sean! I am knee-jerk.
Sean: It's skewed.
Dick: Knee-jerk. (amused) (Maddox laughs) What do you think? What's the minutes?
Sean: SOME jerk. (Maddox giggles more)
Dick: No guess?
Sean: No. No guess.
Dick: No guess, don't care. Alright. So my, um...my life coach's wife is outta town.
Dick: Which means that I swoop in like the mistress.
Dick: As soon as she's on the plane, I'm in there. And I'm like, "Alright, buddy. Let's get to a bar, let's plan out the weekend." Right? So we roll into this, uh, this bar in San Pedro, which I only say because it's a...it's a port town, and port towns are usually very unionized.
Dick: Right? Like, they...they're in support of the unions. Everybody there belongs to a union, they go back generations. Unions.
Maddox: Because they have, uh...shipments. Shipments that come in, right?
Dick: Loadin' docks...
Maddox: Loadin' docks, yeah.
Dick: ...unloading docks, everybody's part of the local UA-whatever.
Dick: Or whatever it is. I don't know what it is. So we go into this bar, start drinkin' at about 10 A.M., planning out our day, and in comes some, uh... (chuckles) In comes some real bruisers. And their husbands. Right? (Sean laughs in the background) And we get the idea...I'm like, "Hey, this is what we gotta do today. We got a good buzz on. We gotta go get a pool and set it up on your balcony, or on your patio, and start moving TVs and couches outside so we can really turn this weekend into a debauch." Right?
Maddox: So you're moving the furniture into the pool?
Dick: Outside...we're moving it outside. First we're gonna get a pool and set up a big pool outside on the patio.
Dick: Right? Great idea so far, right?
Dick: We're gonna need to watch TV as we're out there. Right?
Maddox: You're gonna need to. (teasing)
Dick: And we're not gonna go inside and get water all inside...
Dick: ...to get more beers.
Maddox: That's stupid.
Dick: We gotta bring a cooler or a refrigerator or something outside.
Maddox: Of course.
Dick: Right? So where are we gonna get all this stuff on a Saturday morning?
Dick: Gotta go to Wal Mart.
Dick: To get a pool, like a giant...like, we want a doughboy pool.
Maddox: Wal Mart.
Dick: 4 feet tall. Wal Mart.
Dick: And one of these bruisers starts spouting off about how we're bad people, 'cause we're goin' to Wal Mart. Right?
Maddox: Who...? Oh, oh, the, uh...who's the bruiser...
Dick: One of these patrons.
Maddox: The union workers, right?
Dick: One of these union patrons, right at the bar.
Maddox: Okay. Yeah.
Dick: "Oh, they got these labor practices, and blah blah blah blah blah blah blah."
Maddox: Well, they're awful, but go...yeah.
Dick: Well, that's what I looked up!
Dick: Wage theft!
Dick: That is the, um...that is the illegal withholding of wages or the denial of benefits that are rightfully owed to an employee. It can be conducted through various means: failure to pay, overtime, minimum wage violations, employee misclassification -- which is an interesting one -- illegal deductions in pay, working off the clock, or just not being paid at all.
Dick: Yeah. You know how much this adds up to for everyone in America?
Maddox: Wage theft?
Maddox: How much?
Dick: 15%...up to 15% of your annual salary.
Dick: Is getting docked. Is just...just blatant wage theft. Blatant wage theft.
Maddox: How specifically?
Dick: I'll get to that. (Maddox chuckles)
Maddox: I know where this is goin'.
Dick: Uh, that 15...what? What? Where do you think it's goin'?
Maddox: Like a fuckin' Mack truck. Anti-union Dick Masterson. That's what this is. (grins)
Dick: Why do you think that's anti-union?
Maddox: Well, I'm curious 'cause that could be what you're talkin' about.
Dick: Why do you think it is?
Maddox: Well, because I know that some unions have mandatory dues that you have to pay and some industries have unions that you have to join to work them, and if you don't join the union they will force you out of the job eventually.
Dick: Oh, like clothes shops? No no no, man. This is way worse. 15% of your annual salary, by the way?
Dick: Is almost as much as income taxes. So this is a very big problem, 'cause as you know I think that's the biggest problem.
Maddox: (chuckles) Sure.
Dick: Um...low-income workers experience wage theft through unpaid hours, unpaid overtime, and sub-minimum wages on a weekly basis. Lose about 15% of their income, 2,000 a year...look, here's what wage theft is. So you're working at a restaurant or whatever.
Dick: Right? And you gotta clock out in 6 hours or the boss gets pissed off at you.
Dick: Because then you're legally entitled to a break.
Dick: Like a lunch break. Right?
Dick: So they say "clock out when the clock strikes 6, but then work another half hour because you gotta sweep up."
Maddox: Oh yeah, big problem.
Dick: Oh, yeah! It's a big fuckin' problem.
Maddox: I've...I have experienced this many times in my life. Okay, if this your problem, Dick, I'm -
Dick: (interjects) Here's another example.
Maddox: I'm totally on board with this.
Dick: Oh, now you're on board.
Maddox: No, this is...this is a big problem!
Dick: NOW you think it's a big problem when I phrase it like that.
Maddox: When you phrase it like that, yeah, of course. (Dick laughs)
Dick: Yeah. Um, let me get another one: misclassification of employees. So this is when...take this. Here's an example.
Dick: Assistant managers at Wal Mart. They'll be told to do lower-level employee work.
Dick: Right? Like greeting at the door, stocking shelves, shit like that, and they're like, "Well, you're the manager. You gotta take care of it."
Dick: However, legally, managers don't get overtime.
Dick: Which is time and a half, over 40...so they'll end up working a shitload more hours. They'll just give 'em the title of manager...
Maddox: Right, with no -
Dick: ...so they don't have to pay them.
Maddox: With no increased pay, by the way. A lot of times they'll give you the new title and put you on a salary with...when you work out the hours you're working, it always favors the company.
Dick: Yeah, it's just free...it's just free work.
Dick: Uh, illegal deductions...did I go through that one yet? 'Cause I don't even understand that one. Full-on wage theft is just blatant wage theft for an employee not being paid for work done. Okay, here's how much this costs every year.
Dick: Robbery: costs $340 million a year.
Dick: Robbery. Just...just robbery. Like, the crime of robbery.
Maddox: Oh, oh, right. Okay.
Dick: Yeah yeah yeah.
Dick: Auto theft: $3.8 billion a year.
Dick: Burglary: $4 billion a year.
Dick: Larceny: $5 billion. Wage theft: $19 billion.
Dick: Every year, it's costing.
Maddox: $19 billion!
Maddox: Who, uh, who's responsible for this theft, Dick?
Dick: What do you mean?
Maddox: Uh...like, who? Who are these criminals?
Dick: Oh, are you tryin' to make it, like, a corporation thing?
Maddox: Oh wait, did I say...did I say corporations?! Oh, wait a second! But I thought corporations were the solution, dickhead!
Maddox: I thought corporations were the ones you were lionizing for fuckin' a whole episode...
Dick: Oh, man. (sighing)
Maddox: ...and then my whole fuckin' problem bein' a contrarian dickhead! These same fuckers are stealing $19 billion! These same pandering assholes who don't give a shit about anything but their bottom line. (yelling)
Maddox: These motherfuckers! These are the ones you're defending, and lo and behold, they're the problem. Thank you.
Sean: Look at how happy he is.
Dick: I know, and it's...
Maddox: (clapping sound effect) (laughs)
Dick: It's funny to watch you be so happy, but it is also painful to see you nitpick a problem...
Dick: ...like, just based on something I said in the past. (Maddox laughs loudly)
Maddox: Based on other things I believe! (laughs more)
Dick: Well, hold...hold on. Do you think that I think just corporations are just good guys?
Maddox: I think that you think corporations are more good than bad. You called the corporation the greatest invention of mankind, I believe. (chuckling)
Dick: Yeah, I think that.
Maddox: Yeah. Okay. (laughs more)
Dick: But these are...
Maddox: So which is it?!
Dick: Well, these exist because laws let them do this. Like, tipping is a form of wage theft.
Dick: Because you can...there's minimum-wage laws for a reason, and they can say, "Here..." They're allowed to hire you at less than minimum wage, and you make it up with tips...
Dick: ...but then you don't. Like, it's a...it sets up a weird...uh, it sets up a weird economy.
Maddox: Yeah, I agree. Tipping...
Dick: For waitresses.
Maddox: Tipping is a problem, but not as a big of a...so laws, laws are the bad guys. Corporations are the good guys, but it's just these damn laws! Golly! If only we could get these laws... (breaks down laughing)
Dick: I get that you're being very sarcastic, but I'm failing to connect the dots that you're making.
Maddox: Oh, I know!
Dick: You just think it's a result of not being, uh...
Maddox: I think it's -
Dick: ...intellectual enough?
Maddox: No, I think it's... (cracks up) No. No, not you. This isn't a statement about you, Dick.
Dick: No, go ahead! Go ahead.
Maddox: I think that the...that...um, the invention of the corporation?
Maddox: Because they are a business, and businesses have only one thing...one objective in life, and that is to make as much money as possible. And because of that, you get all these other problems, these umbrella problems, which I won't go into too much here because I'll bring that in as a problem some other day.
Maddox: But all these umbrella problems -- this wage theft, insincerity in their marketing, pandering, enforcing unruly drug laws -- these are all problems that fall under that umbrella. But wage theft specifically, and what you talked about with tips, I know...one of my neighbors, actually, used to work for a restaurant in my neighborhood.
Maddox: And I f-...and she quit and she said, "Don't go there, it's horrible," and I found out that, uh...and I heard this through many people who work there. They don't pay out tips to their employees. They just pocket the tips.
Dick: They just pocket 'em?
Maddox: Which is literally wage theft. That's exactly what you're talking about, yeah.
Dick: Yeah! That's what...yeah, that's one of the examples. Well, I brought it in. I won't go through it anymore, because the gloating is annoying me. (Maddox and Sean laugh) Uh, but I will -
Maddox: (interjects) Oh, the...oh, my gloating is annoying? (laughing)
Dick: Well yeah, because it's-...it's like, I don't even understand what you think about corporations. Like, of course it's...they always obey the law.
Dick: Like, they do whatever the law lets them do!
Maddox: Sure, like especially when they hire illegal immigrants. They're obeying the law there. (Dick stammers) (both laugh)
Dick: Yeah. Uh, if they get a Social Security number, it's not their responsibility to track it down.
Maddox: Sure. (cynical)
Dick: You're just -
Maddox: (interjects) This guy doesn't speak English, he came in...you know? He doesn't drive to work every day, he gets dropped off in a pickup truck. You know what he's gotta - (Sean laughs in the background)
Dick: (interjects) Oh, so then he's il-...it must be an illegal.
Maddox: No, but let's just...
Maddox: Let's not, uh...
Dick: Let's call a spade a spade, is what you're saying.
Maddox: Let's not ask any questions, right? But if somebody comes into work, their eyes are a little bloodshot, maybe they had a little too much partying last night. Oh, THEN we're gonna investigate! Let's get a piss test. Let's go down this rabbit hole, huh, dickhead? That's when it's a problem, is when they're enforcing drug laws, but not when they hire illegal immigrants. Corporations always follow the law! These corporations? Okay.
Maddox: Alright. (chuckling)
Dick: Hah. (quietly) (Maddox giggles) Well, I think it's a big problem, and it's not only...it doesn't only affect low wage earners. I brought in a buncha shit about the high-tech wage theft too.
Maddox: Yeah, I wanna hear about this.
Dick: Well, it's...I'm sure you have heard about it. It's just the back-and-forth between Steve Jobs and Eric Schmidt and Sergey Brin and all these people who just, uh, decided that they wouldn't poach each other's employees.
Maddox: Oh, yeah!
Dick: 'Cause it was bad for the bottom line.
Maddox: No, this is really interesting. Let's talk about this.
Dick: Yeah, and it ends up...they're estimating that it cost these high-tech employees $9 billion over like 4 years. And I'm just like... (stammers) ...imagining how fucked this is for the system as a whole, that these kids will go to school, they'll go to, like, a very expensive school...
Dick: ...and try to...and train for these skills their whole lives, and they're glass-ceilinged like the second they get a job.
Dick: And they can never get above it because of these, like, illegal practices (Maddox laughs) of wage manipulation.
Sean: Well, it's...it's collusion, isn't it?
Dick: Yeah, it's blatant collusion.
Maddox: It's collusion. (laughing)
Maddox: But didn't you say a second ago... (laughs more)
Dick: I can't...I don't know why you think this is...like, I don't know why you think this is -
Maddox: (interjects) You said a second ago corporations always follow laws, dickhead! You said that.
Dick: Well, they're -
Maddox: (interjects) Do you believe it or not?
Dick: Do I believe that they always follow the law??
Dick: Of course people are doing illegal shit, Maddox!
Maddox: Okay. Alllright. Alright. So I...but back -
Dick: (interjects) What the fuck?! Where do you...where are you pulling this from? Like, honestly?
Maddox: What you...literally your quotes.
Maddox: Literally things you just said.
Dick: No, go ahead. Go ahead.
Maddox: But I wanna talk about this. This is really interesting, this collusion.
Maddox: I want to explain for people who don't know about this high-tech wage theft. This is super interesting. So Apple and Google, very notorious competitors in Silicon Valley.
Maddox: They uncovered in court records that there was some collusion between the two companies. They had a handshake agreement...you know, kind of a nod, a boys' club, like not to hire...a gentlemen's agreement. That's what I wanna say.
Dick: It was not a gentlemen's agreement. It was a threat.
Maddox: Oh, okay. Well.
Dick: Jobs emailed them saying "Hey, if you guys don't stop doing this, we'll do it to you."
Dick: "And we've got bigger pockets."
Maddox: Well, there you go!
Dick: "So stop doing it."
Maddox: The magnanimous Steve Jobs threatened Google not to hire their -
Dick: (interjects) I think it was HP.
Maddox: Their employees.
Maddox: Okay, well, whatever it was, they threatened each other not to hire each other's employees.
Maddox: And there's kind of an unspoken agreement, or in this case literally spoken agreement...
Maddox: ...not to hire each other's employees, and what that does is artificially suppresses competition in the job market.
Maddox: And artificially...excuse me, artificially lowers the wages of employees.
Maddox: Does that...so you're saying that falls under wage theft?
Dick: Of course!
Maddox: I'm on board...that's a huge problem. And lemme tell you another way I personally have experienced wage theft.
Maddox: SO many ways. First of all, I've only had two jobs in my life. My first job was at KFC and I was a cook, and by law, by Utah state law, we had...we were required to take two breaks during an 8-hour shift. We had two 15-minute breaks and a half-hour lunch.
Maddox: The half-hour was unpaid, and they told us all these breaks and our lunch were completely optional, so I tested it out. The first time...the first day I got there, I thought, "Well, I'm here. Here I am, I'm doin' training. I'm, uh...you know, I got my...I put in my 4 hours, I'm gonna take my 15-minute break and eat a snack. They said we can eat during our lunch breaks," right?
Maddox: I sat down, and I got the most evil eyes I've ever gotten in my life.
Maddox: Not just from my co-workers, but from the manager, the supervisor, the people working in the front. They came back specifically...they would do double takes when they saw me sitting down for a few minutes, and then I kinda got the message: "We're not supposed to take breaks."
Maddox: And, uh...and then another kid didn't get that message, and he continued to take his breaks. He was fired 2 weeks later.
Dick: Yeah, that's what they're sayin' on some of these Wal Mart articles I'm looking at. Like the, um...the intimidation into not taking what...like, optional breaks?
Dick: So there was this...there was some law that was, um, that was pitched up in...I forget where it was, Wisconsin. I didn't bring it in, but the idea was to get rid of the mandatory 5-day week, like that employers could make a deal with somebody to give up their optional weekend day? So it would make the weekends optional.
Dick: So to speak.
Dick: Yeah. 'Cause I was gonna bring weekends.
Dick: Because we bought that giant pool only to find...my life coach and I bought that gigantic pool only to find that there was no water-delivering services open on the weekend.
Dick: So I was like, "Well, fuck weekends."
Maddox: Oh, okay. (laughing)
Dick: Right? Like, why do we have them?
Maddox: Why did you need water-del-...excuse me, a water-delivering service? Couldn't you just turn on the hose?
Dick: No, it was huge, man! It was huge. It would've taken hours to fill up, and we needed it right then.
Dick: Yeah. 'Cause...and it's like everybody taking off on the weekend totally screwed that, and everything's always jammed on the weekends.
Dick: But then I was l-...then I found all this wage theft shit, and part of it was, yeah, the unspoken intimidation of people taking their breaks and their time off, and it's like...it's easy to say "Look, just sack up and don't do it," right?
Dick: But it's not realistic. Like, as much as I wish it was, it's just not. 'Cause there's a cost...there's a cost in looking for another job.
Dick: There's a cost in, like, not being taken advantage of in this scale, which is why I think it's such a big problem, because it's...it can't be solved.
Maddox: Hmm. I don't know that it can't be solved, Dick, because there are companies...like for example, I know a lot of Google employees.
Maddox: And they love it there. They...Google really treats their employees well.
Maddox: They get their breaks, they get their lunch, it's mostly paid for. They get maternity leave, paternity leave, whatever you want. Google takes care of their employees.
Maddox: So I'm not saying...let's not pretend like this is a problem with no solution here. This is...this really comes down to the magnanimity of your employer and how penny-pinching they are and how important their bottom line is to them, but...
Dick: Yeah, but every company here is part of it.
Dick: Google's part of this lawsuit...yeah, they are.
Maddox: Well, okay, but Google...so Google does it in a high-tech way. They do it by suppressing wages by agreeing not to hire competitors' employees.
Dick: Well, yeah, that's even worse!
Dick: Fuck, you...it takes away your personal autonomy to, like, sell your time and...
Dick: ...make...and get more money.
Maddox: Yeah, it's bad, Dick. I'll -
Dick: (interjects) That should be...that's WAY more than tips! That's way worse than somebody who's gotta work like an extra 5 minutes at work 'cause their manager's a prick.
Maddox: I disagree, because when it comes to tips, those are low-earning wage workers, and they need every dollar. They're scrapin' by. But when it comes to Google...I mean, what they're doing is wrong and evil, for sure. "Don't be evil," my ass.
Maddox: BUT, it is not worse because the employees that they're talking about suppressing their wages, they're already making north of 6 figures. North of...5, 6 figures.
Dick: That's where every dollar counts.
Maddox: Yeah, okay. (chuckling)
Maddox: They're already living in really expensive lofts in downtown San Francisco and making good wages and good livings. I mean, I'm not...I'm not as worried about them.
Dick: Ah, I think that's a bad way to look at it.
Maddox: Well, why is it a bad way to look at it, Dick? Because if you're trying to say absolutely which is worse, I think that the wage theft, when it comes from somebody who has shallow pockets, is way worse than wage theft from somebody who has deep pockets.
Dick: Well, you kinda just introduced that though. Like, no one was looking at which one was bad...which one was worse than the other.
Maddox: No, you just said that. You literally just said that a few minutes ago.
Dick: Yeah, in response to yours, (Maddox scoffs) but I didn't make it about that in the first place.
Dick: It was just, this is...they're part of this lawsuit.
Dick: Google is, HP is; I got the whole list here.
Maddox: I had -
Dick: (interjects) But it's the...it's all the big ones. Lucasfilm -- the special effects guys -- Apple, of course...
Maddox: Wow, Lucas is in on this too, huh? So a long time ago -
Dick: (interjects) Oh yeah, you wanna hear his quote from it?
Maddox: Yeah, let's hear it.
Dick: Uh, George Lucas says...this is when he said that they shouldn't compete against one another for talent. "It's not a normal industrial competitive situation. The rule we had, or the rule that I put down for everybody, was that we cannot get into a bidding war with other companies because we don't have the margins for that kind of thing."
Maddox: Oh. (sneering)
Dick: And they definitely do.
Maddox: Lucas, yeah.
Dick: That's just like...that's like, "Yeah, you're doing something blatantly illegal to make more money. That..."
Dick: "That's illegal."
Maddox: It's illegal.
Dick: It's illegal.
Maddox: To make more money on top of your already lavish profits.
Dick: Well, again...
Maddox: It's lavish.
Dick: See, but why does it always...why does that have to come into it?
Maddox: It matters!
Dick: Why does it matter? It's already illegal!
Maddox: Because it comes down to greed, Dick. (Dick stammers) How much is enough, Dick? For you, infinite!
Dick: Here's what you...no, this is what you sound like. It's like, you know how Ellen Pao got kicked out recently? She stepped down as the CEO of Reddit?
Maddox: (clapping sound effect) Yes.
Dick: Right! Yeah. Ding-dong, the witch is dead. Fuck her.
Maddox: ('ding!' sound effect)
Dick: Good luck paying for your, uh...your counter-lawsuit, bitch.
Sean: Lasted 5 weeks, right?
Sean: She managed to fuck everything up in 5 weeks.
Dick: Yeah. Interim with a capital, uh, 'M'.
Sean: Piss everybody off.
Dick: Yeah. Um...
Maddox: Didn't understand the userbase.
Dick: At all.
Maddox: And its whole...yeah.
Dick: So every once in a while, somebody would list all the things she did wrong.
Dick: And they would list all the things she did wrong, but then at the very end they would throw in, "She had sex with a married man..."
Dick: "...at her other firm," and it's like, "Ah, you..."
Maddox: 'Cause that...that's ethical.
Dick: "You fuck up your whole...you fuck up your whole thing by throwin' that in."
Dick: "You fuck up your..." Because it's not, like...it's not a hard, factual piece of evidence.
Dick: Like, the other stuff was good enough.
Dick: You didn't need to throw some kind of ethical spin on it.
Maddox: Sure. That's fair.
Dick: Yeah. That's what you're doin' with the "Well, fuck 'em. They're too greedy 'cause they already have enough money."
Dick: Like, couldn't it just be that they're doing something illegal that hurts...wage earners?
Maddox: Oh, I see what you're saying. Okay.
Dick: Yeah. Does it have to be that "oh, they're already so rich" as well?
Dick: Like, that's totally irrelevant!
Maddox: Because...Dick, I think that people have an averse response and reaction to greed in this culture, in this society. Maybe it's just because of the culture we were raised in, because of...uh, fairy tales, like Scrooge around Christmas, where the lesson there is not to put money over people, right? Not to put money over family, not to put money over tradition and religion, and all these other things that are supposedly values in life.
Maddox: And I think that just this very problem that you brought in is evidence of how that can be a huge problem, when you DO put that money over people. Because this problem that you're talking about right now, Dick?
Maddox: Arises from greed! That's all this is. It's just greed. Companies are already profitable, and they just want more. Sure, fuck it! Fire someone right before Christmas. They got a family? Fuck their family.
Maddox: We're gonna save a few dollars. That's what it comes down to, and I'll tell you how it's personally hurt me and affected me. At my old job at the telemarketing company, I put in multiple 24-hour shifts, Dick. That's...REALLY bad. That's really shitty.
Maddox: I remember I slept at my desk for like an hour, woke up, trying to finish a deadline. I came in one time on Thanksgiving. I had to leave my family and come to work and work on a project for a company...to do nothing but to pad the profits of the company that I was working for. I got nothing out of it!
Maddox: They didn't give me a bonus, and I remember every now and then they would corral us into the conference room to make a big announcement that we would all be happy about, right? And the big announcement was they just signed 3 or 4 new clients, and there was kind of a smattering in the conference room and a cough.
Maddox: Nobody cared, because that just meant more work for us. We saw nothing of it. There was no profit sharing. There was nothing in it for us! It just meant more work! And then I also got fucked over at my old job too, 'cause I would have to clock out -- at KFC -- and then just as I'm about to step out the door: "Oh hey, uh, can you help me with this one thing? Can you clean out that last cooker?" The last cooker.
Maddox: The one that's the dirtiest. The one that takes 45 minutes to clean. And I ended up stayin' there scrubbing another 2 hours. "Oh hey, and by the way, we just found out that the inspector's comin' by tomorrow, and we have to scrub the entire floor." "Oh really? So I guess this 45-minute job that you wanted me to do unpaid has ballooned into 3-4 hours? Okay."
Dick: Well, that's why I think it's such a big problem, 'cause you can't fix it. (Maddox chuckles)
Maddox: You CAN.
Dick: Like, that's...it doesn't...that's already illegal. Right? But how are you gonna get compensated for that? You can't!!
Maddox: Dick, if -
Dick: (interjects) If they...you're gonna get fired for not doing it. What recourse do you have, a class-action lawsuit where you see like $5? You already lost the time!
Maddox: No, the class-action lawsuit can potentially be corrective, but...I'm not gonna go into that, 'cause I don't know. I don't have the stats or research in front of me. I think this can be corrected by incentivizing good behavior in corporations. So...and I don't know how that is, I don't know what that is, but I think if they had an incentive...people complain about government, right? Here's my whole thing with the whole libertarian agenda. You didn't see that comin'! Came in way late into the problem, but here's my whole thing with the libertarian agenda. Libertarians generally are opposed to bigger government, because fundamentally they believe that governments are inefficient and they don't do a good job and they are ineffective, and I don't think that it's necessarily the case because the problem with government is lack of accountability. They don't give a shit. They don't have anyone to answer to. You go to the DMV and you wait 45 minutes to an hour in line? Ah, it's all the same to them! They don't give a fuck. You're just another number to them. You just walk right through, you walk in, maybe you get served, maybe not; they don't give a shit. They have no one to answer to.
Maddox: But the second you start introducing accountability to these fuckers, then they'll start to play ball. If you suddenly said, "Okay, you got a...you have a quota to reach. If you don't get these customers served at the DMV line in this allotted time, we're gonna cut your funding. And if we cut your funding, that means we're firing your ass."
Dick: You just proved why this is unfixable, 'cause the only way...the only way to do that is by acting like these companies are.
Dick: By hitting these numbers no matter what the cost.
Maddox: But that's specifically government. Now we're talking about corporations. How -
Dick: (interjects) That's how people work, though.
Maddox: But how to fix this corporate problem, right? What if you incentivized good behavior? What if you said, "Okay. Well, if..." (stammers) I'm trying to think of a solution off the top of my head, but if they found that you were doing these shady practices by creating an anonymous network where employees could...in fact, there is that law. There's the whistleblower law.
Maddox: Employees could alert the government that this company 'X, Y and Z' is doing this...this deplorable behavior, and they find out about it, then not only do they get punished but, um...
Dick: They get double punished?
Maddox: No, maybe...maybe they reward their competitor or somethin' like that. I don't know. I don't know what the solution is.
Dick: I'll tell you how we fix it. We gotta bring back hanging.
Maddox: Okay. (laughs)
Dick: That's...Steve Jobs sends an email like "no hiring each other's employees"? We gotta hang that guy.
Dick: He's too rich!
Dick: You can't legally...get him!
Dick: You know? That's how you fix it. That's the only way.
Maddox: The eye choke.
Dick: Yeah. No, I don't know, I don't think there is a way to fix it.
Maddox: Well, who knows, Dick, but I think if you incentivize good behavior and had more accountability...well, the accountability problem is the problem with government. But this corporation one, I bet there is a solution, 'cause I don't think that this is a problem with no solution. Because first of all...I mean, I run a company, right? And I like to treat my...the people I work with fairly. I don't like free work. I like to pay people SOMETHING, right? Even if it's not a lot, because I'm not making a lot, but it...I like to pay them something, and at the end of the day, if more people had that attitude...and I don't believe it's all corporations. I think some corporations are run by good people who do try to treat their employees fairly and they aren't about that wage theft.
Dick: Well, it's pretty clear that everybody was hunky-dory until Steve Jobs started firing off these emails.
Dick: Like, of wage-fixing. You know?
Dick: Which says a lot.
Maddox: Well Dick, uh, is that all you got?
Maddox: Um...I can just cruise through this last problem.
Dick: I don't think we have time for it.
Maddox: Welp... (both laugh) I have to mention it because of what I was about to say. My segue's totally ruined!!
Maddox: But I don't know if you've noticed, but my voice is a little hoarse. It's hoarse because I just got back from Comic-Con, and that's what everyone's voice sounds like at the end of Comic-Con. It's fucking awful. I hate it, and everyone asks me, "Hey, did you have a good time?" No, I fuckin' worked! It's awful. (laughs) For...it's...
Dick: At Comic-Con?
Maddox: It's fun for everyone else, but for the poor exhibiters who are working their asses off, it's awful. And, uh, my problem was related to that. I'll just...I'll just breeze through it real quick, but it's just people texting in public walkways, Dick.
Maddox: I'm so fucking tired of it.
Maddox: You can't walk anywhere in Comic-Con. It's already a bad situation, exacerbated and made worse because every dickhead is sitting there Instagramming and Latergramming and tweeting and hashtagging all their fucking social networks, sending their friends texts! Hey dickhead, why don't you live in this fucking moment that you're in right now? LOOK UP. These fuckin' assholes, texting constantly. Which, by the way, I have an anecdote about that, a little story. I don't think I've talked about, um...what's his name, uh...Don Cheadle! Did I mention the Don Cheadle story on this episode?
Maddox: I was wa-...I was ridin' my bike down the street the other day and I saw Don Cheadle come out of a building, and right in front of him was a big TMZ tour bus. TMZ, the media channel, right?
Maddox: Yeah, and not a single person on the bus noticed because they are all busy texting. (Dick laughs) Every single person on the bus was looking down at their cell phones, and Don Cheadle was right in front of them!
Maddox: That made me so happy.
Dick: That's funny.
Maddox: That's the one time it made me happy, yeah.
Maddox: But texting in public walkways...Sean, before the episode started, you mentioned that you're tired of seeing people text through walkways, right?
Sean: Through crosswalks.
Maddox: Through crosswalks!
Sean: There has to be way more pedestrians getting hit by cars because of that.
Dick: And bicycles.
Sean: Yeah, and bicycles.
Maddox: Oh, through the roof when you count bicycles! You know those cyclists riding 12 miles per hour running into you, flesh-on-flesh? Oh my gosh. The massacres. (smiles) The massacres! Can't even imagine. By the way Dick, remember that, uh, that subreddit -- speaking of Ellen Pao earlier -- that got shut down? That, uh, CuteCorpses?
Maddox: Cute... (cracks up) I was lookin' -
Dick: (interjects) CuteFemaleCorpses.
Maddox: CuteFemaleCorpses, of course. Yeah, we wanna be specific. The CuteMaleCorpses subreddit is still thriving. But the CuteFemaleCorpses, um...I was lookin' through it, and one of 'em was this really cute chick who got hit on her...on her bike. Hit and run, car.
Maddox: Uh, head blown out all over the sidewalk, so.
Maddox: That's what your bicycler hate does.
Sean: Wait wait wait, "really cute chick"?
Maddox: Well, she was -
Sean: (interjects) With her head blown out? (Dick laughs)
Maddox: She WAS cute.
Dick: Yeah Sean, you got a problem with that?
Dick: What do you look for in a woman? (grins)
Sean: They put a "before" picture with it?
Dick: A head?
Maddox: Yeah, they put a "before" picture.
Sean: Okay. Oh. (Dick chuckles)
Maddox: She was really cute, yeah. Head blown out.
Dick: That sucks.
Maddox: That's what your cyclist hate gets.
Dick: Wait, what?
Maddox: A buncha cars drivin' like dickheads and being aggressive toward cyclists. I'm so glad that problem got voted down.
Dick: Yeah. (quietly)
Maddox: I'm so -
Dick: (interjects) Is that it? Of your selfie problem? Or of your...
Maddox: (sighs) Yeah, no...I mean, I -
Dick: (interjects) Oh, I saw some selfie sticks in the wild, by the way!
Maddox: Oh, great!
Dick: Yeah, they...they weren't that bad!
Maddox: What do you mean, "they're not that bad"?
Dick: Like, there were people...people were sitting on a bench taking them. I think this is a big problem though, people walkin' around with their heads buried in their cell phones.
Maddox: Did you know that someone recently got killed because of a selfie stick?
Maddox: They were holding it out...they were hiking and they were taking pictures of themselves, and lightning struck them. (smiles)
Dick: Ah! (Sean laughs in the background)
Maddox: Makes me so happy. (Dick chuckles) (baby laugh sound effect) Anyway Dick, that's my problem. (laughing) Um...
Dick: It's a big problem!
Maddox: Ye-...what? People s-...people texting??
Dick: I don't think there's a solution for that one either.
Maddox: Well, sure there is! I think... (stammers) You know what the problem is, that culture...first of all, technology has changed so fast that culture hasn't had time...had a chance...society has not had a chance to adapt to it...
Maddox: ...with etiquette. There used to be manuals in etiquette that came out. There was, uh, Hill's Social Guide to Etiquette or somethin' like that?
Maddox: It's a book! People wrote books on etiquette.
Maddox: Today, we have technology that comes out that didn't exist a year ago, and people don't even know how to adapt. Like for example, Google Glass. Google Glass just popped up, and then all of a sudden people had a problem with it.
Dick: 'Cause it was annoying.
Maddox: No, because they were afraid of their privacy being violated.
Dick: Eh, I think it was 'cause it was annoying. (Maddox laughs)
Dick: Nobody really cared about their privacy.
Maddox: Oh, okay. (grinning) Anyway -
Dick: (interjects) Yeah, but then you also got everyone...like, everybody's so proud of being, uh, rude and obnoxious these days. It's like, "Oh, you got a problem with me? I don't give a fuuuuck! I do what I want!" It's like, that's...that's like the cultural norm, which...
Maddox: (interjects) You know, that's why -
Dick: ...is an additional problem.
Maddox: That's kinda why I like Sonic. He's got so much attitude. (grins)
Maddox: He's cool. Anyway man, my problems this week are Stoner Marketing and People Who Text In Public Walkways. (closing riff starts)
Dick: And my problem's Wage Theft.
Maddox: Big problem, Dick.
Maddox: I'm actually on board with it.
Dick: Oh. (chuckling)
Maddox: I'm gonna give you an upvote!
Dick: See you next Tuesday.
Dick: Oh, wait a minute. I forgot this.
Maddox: Oh, dammit. (whispering) [Dick plays "My Heart Will Go On" parody] Fuck!
Dick: I'm only playing this song 'cause Jack Horner died.
Maddox: Who's that?
Dick: Remember that?
Maddox: Oh, the uh...
Dick: It was the composer.
Maddox: ...composer? Yeah.
Maddox: Yeah. (irritated)
Dick: ...composer. Show some respect. (Maddox laughs)
Maddox: Think there was any wage theft there?
Dick: I don't know. I don't know how James Cameron...rolls.
Male singer: Maddox is an asshole...
Maddox: Probably...he's a...pro-... (yells over song) He's probably a greedy fucker!! I fucking hate this song!
Male singer: ...and he can go fuck himself...
Maddox: He just made...this was a cash grab. This whole fucking movie's a cash grab!
Dick: This movie's a cash grab??
Maddox: Yeah. How much money did he give to the survivors of the Titanic?
Male singer: ...his problems all suck and he deseeeeeerves this.
Dick: I don't know. You read a lot into these, uh, cash grabs.
Maddox: Oh, it's a cash grab?
Dick: You're always on about.
Maddox: Yeah. What if someone made a story about your life and didn't give you a dollar?
Male singer: Keeeeep playing these Tiiiiitanic clips...
Dick: They did! (Maddox laughs)
Maddox: Oh yeah? What?
Dick: Yeah. It was called, uh... (stammers) "Rocky..."
Maddox: "Magic Mike." (laughs hysterically)
Male singer: ...and Dick, youuuu can go on and...
Dick: "Rocky W-..." Yeah. "Magic Mike XL." No, the first one's not about me. (Maddox still giggling) The first one's about my dad.
Maddox: Oh, okay.
Dick: The sequel is about me.
Maddox: Oh, alright. (Dick laughs)
Male singer: ...go on and go fuuuuuuuuck yourself.
Maddox: Fuck yourself. I hate that song. (muttering)
Dick: Alright, here you go. Actually watch this clip this time.
Maddox: Okay. I'll watch it, Dick.
Maddox: Yeah. Here we go.
Dick: 'Cause you have totally not been watching.
Maddox: I'll watch it.
Dick: And this is a good... [plays next 30 seconds of Titanic] It's finally getting good.
Maddox: Oh. Well, I gotta go to the bathroom.
(ship deck noises)
Maddox: (laughs smugly) I'm not looking.
Guy on ship: Satellite call for you!
Maddox: That was a total lie, I'm not lookin'. I'm never gonna watch! I'm NEVER gonna watch.
Dick: I'm just gonna let it play then.
Guy on ship: You wanna take this call.
(more ship noises in background)
Dick: Something interesting is happening.
Dick: Something really...
Guy on ship: Now, you gotta speak up. She's kinda old.
Dick: They're...shitting on old people.
Maddox: I... (cracks up)
Dick: You looked!! I saw you look!
Maddox: No I didn't! No I didn't!
Dick: I saw you look down at it.
Maddox: No I didn't! No, I looked down at my KNUCKLES.
Guy on ship: Rose Calvert. (hands phone over)
Bill Paxton: Mrs. Calvert?
Old lady: I was just wondering...
Maddox: Oh, I hate that voice.
Old lady: ...if you had found the Heart of the Ocean yet?
Dick: Heart of the Ocean!
Maddox: Heart of the Ocean? (flatly)
(dreamy movie score)
Dick: What could it be?
Guy on ship: Told you you wanted to take the call.
Maddox: It's a fuckin' jewel! I know it's a fuckin' jewel.
Dick: Ohh, it could be a jewel!
Maddox: Yeah. (scoffing)
Dick: Is it...
Bill Paxton: Alright, you have my attention, Rose.
Bill Paxton: Can you tell us who the woman in the picture is?
Dick: That's the naked woman, Maddox.
Maddox: Not gonna look. No. (muttering)
Old lady: Yes. The woman in the picture is me.
(music swells dramatically)
Maddox: ('sproing' [boner] sound effect) (both laugh loudly) Oo, baby!
Dick: Yeah. Do you want any voicemails?
Dick: Alright. [plays first voicemail message]
Voicemail (male caller): (goofy Southern twang) Well, hey there, Maddox! This is the old host of The Imagination Station. (Maddox laughs loudly)
Dick: Is that him?
Maddox: Kinda sounds like him.
Voicemail: I just wanted to call in and tell you that of course I remember you! You were that sad, lonely little boy... (Maddox cracks up)
Dick: Lonely, huh?
Voicemail: ...who always called in to my program. Well, now I hear that ya have your own program, and I decided to listen to a few episodes and see whatcha made of yourself.
Dick: Oh, that's cool!
Voicemail: And all I can say is...what the fuck happened?!? (everyone laughs) I mean, you used to be so bright and full o'life, and...now you just get into a rage over French bread and people who like pepperoni pizza. (more laughing)
Dick: That's true.
Voicemail: And your ideal world is where most o'humanity is enslaved so you can play video games all day? Ho-ly SHIT. (Dick and Maddox laugh loudly) Well, I'm gonna go drink an entire bottle of vodka and cry myself to sleep. (Maddox laughs)
Maddox: That part's accurate. (keeps laughing)
Voicemail: Fuck you, Maddox.
Maddox: I bet that is where that guy is. He snuck into a bottle.
Dick: Here's somebody defending your Soni-...your Mario and your Sonic art.
Maddox: Oh, great! Let's hear this.
Dick: Yeah. [plays next voicemail message]
Voicemail (male caller): Hey, this is, uh, Scott, a.k.a. NOT John F. Kennedy. This is not how he sounds.
Voicemail: Um...listen, I have a couple quick things that I wanted to bring up regarding Dick on the last episode. Uh...first of all, Dick, 3D modeling and the pictures that people took of Maddox's models? 3D modeling's a little bit like sculpture, okay?
Dick: Hmm, yes.
Voicemail: It doesn't start out looking perfect.
Dick: We all know that.
Voicemail: But there's like two ways of doing it. One's like sculpture and the other one's like papier mache.
Voicemail: As somebody who does 3D modeling, I can tell you that yeah, it does look...start out lookin' like a buncha dog turds, or whatever. ..
Maddox: Yeah. See?!
Voicemail: ...but it's just like with sculpture, man. You sculpt it and you make it look correct.
Maddox: Yeah, man!
Voicemail: You add in the vertexes, and...
Dick: I think you add too many vertexes. That's your problem. (Maddox sneers)
Voicemail: ...the planes and the polygons and everything, and it...that's just how it works, man. (Maddox chuckles) So yeah, it starts out lookin' all blobby and then you refine it. That's 3D modeling. You don't know what you're talkin' about.
Voicemail: And second: hey, Maddox -
Dick: [cuts off message] No, no seconds. We're not doing seconds.
Maddox: Nono, what's the last part of that??
Dick: Oh, it's a whole 'nother minute, dude.
Dick: It's...everybody always tries to cram in multiple things. So he's saying that your 3D modeling's good.
Maddox: Pretty good!
Dick: Well, he says it's shit right now, but it WILL be good.
Maddox: Yeah, that's what I was sa-...I'm saying!! It's a masterpiece! It's not finished yet.
Dick: Well, b-...well, when will it be finished?
Maddox: You know what? I'm going to start new. In under 40 minutes, I'm gonna create a better Sonic than that bozo.
Dick: And it'll be done?
Maddox: (belches) Yeah, it'll be d-...
Dick: Like, it'll be done?
Maddox: It'll be done in under 40 minutes! It has to be, it's a speedrun! It's a world Sonic the Hedgehog speedrun.
Dick: Okay, I can't wait to see it.
Sean: 40 minutes after his book is released. (Dick giggles)
Maddox: Okay, SEAN... (annoyed) We don't have until 2025. (cracks up) (Sean laughs in the background)